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  • Hey, guys. My name is Stan Prokopenko. Welcome to Proko. This is the second critique video

  • on the spine. If you haven't seen the spine lesson yet, go ahead and click the link in

  • the description, or just go to this link here. So all right, let's just go ahead and get

  • started on the critiques.

  • The first critique will be for Alejandro Ferrera Hernandez. He submitted these two, or two

  • images of four drawings, and they're actually pretty nice. I like that they are clean and

  • looks like the spine is generally correct. The biggest thing that stands out to me, the

  • first thing I noticed, was the distance between the rib cage and the pelvis. So you have this

  • distance in here, between the bottom of the rib cage and the top of the pelvis, that much.

  • I would say you can cut that in half. So this ribcage would start right there. Remember

  • that the only thing between the rib cage and the pelvis is the oblique muscle. You can

  • think of them as the love handles, the muffin tops or whatever. And you can grab that with

  • one hand. And the distance that you put in there is like that much on the body, and I

  • can't grab that, right? So let's cut this out and move it down, so it'd be right about

  • there. That would be about the distance I would put in. And then, of course, you would

  • clean up that lumbar spine.

  • Okay, so watch out because you did the same thing on this one and same thing on this one.

  • And actually, it looks like if the rib cage connects here, you're creating that lumbar

  • spine all the way. Yeah, that's too long as well. So all four of them, the lumbar section

  • is just too long. So watch out for that. So I suggest you go back to the spine video and

  • just review the proportions of each section, the lumbar versus the thoracic, versus the

  • cervical, what's the proportion between those three. And that'll help you.

  • Okay, the next critique is for Audie Eagleheart. Let's take a look at what she got. Very nice.

  • Let me see here. So in this first drawing, looks like you did the same one multiple times.

  • All of that looks like the same pose. It looks like all of them, though, have the wrong curvature

  • in the lumbar area. So I'm seeing most of the curvature happening at the top three lumbar

  • vertebrae. And in yours, it's a smooth curve all the way through. In fact, you can continue

  • that smooth curve through the whole spine. And that's not what I'm seeing on this, on

  • the reference. And it's actually not what will happen on a real person. There won't

  • be much lateral bending in this thoracic section. So from here, all the way over to here, there

  • won't be much bending.

  • There will be a lot of bending in the top three of the lumbar, and there's going to

  • be a lot of bending in all of the cervical. And so what you're going to see is a curve

  • pretty extreme in the lumbar, especially at the top portion, and then pretty straight

  • in the thoracic, and then curved again in the cervical. So you can see, it's not one

  • smooth curve like this; they're in sections. Each section moves in a different way. So

  • keep that in mind. The second drawing you did looks like there's too much curvature

  • in the thoracic section. Right here you can see all this curve. I would say it would curve

  • about that much. Remember, the thoracic section mostly does the twisting. It can bend side

  • the side, forward or back a little bit, but most of that is going to be in the lumbar.

  • So you're not going to curve the thoracic section forward as much as you did in this

  • one.

  • On the third one, the thing I want to point out is the sacrum. It looks to me like the

  • top plane is at this angle. So if I was to draw a center line from the back to the front,

  • that's what it would look like. However, your sacrum is kind of like this, right? I'm seeing

  • that from your side planes. It's at an angle like that, which is actually tilted back more

  • than the top plane of the bucket. However, on an anatomically correct model, the sacrum

  • would tilt forward more, like this, okay? So if the top plane is tilted like this, the

  • sacrum would tilt forward like that, okay? So make sure you're not trying to point the

  • sacrum up in the same way as you're tilting the bucket.

  • Looks like you did the same thing in this one. This line from top plane and this line

  • for the sacrum, it's tilting back. I would make it maybe not that much, something like

  • that. Okay? Another thing I'm noticing for the fourth drawing, is that you just went

  • too thin in the neck. It's not going to taper that much. You could see in this reference

  • drawing that it stays pretty thick in there. Obviously, not as thick as this lumbar section,

  • but I think you just tapered too much. Okay, let's move on.

  • These drawings were submitted by Hodge Podge. Doubt that's your real name but okay. Let's

  • see. Oh, right. So the thing I wanted to say with these is, first of all, it's too scratchy.

  • So it's too scratchy for my taste. You could have cleaned them up a little bit, but the

  • other thing I wanted to say is the cross contour lines you're putting on the spine could be

  • a little bit more clear and more accurate. So for example, with this one here at the

  • bottom, looking at this guy, the cross contour line right there that you put, suggests that

  • the spine is pointing directly at us. As if this cylinder... Actually I fixed it a little

  • bit, almost a full circle.

  • You're suggesting that this cylinder is pointing away from us, almost completely away. It's

  • almost a perfect circle. What it was really doing, is it's curving forward just a little

  • bit. And actually, in this section, it's transitioning from curving this way, and curving this way.

  • So it's probably going to be just a straight line, or if anything, maybe a very, very narrow

  • cylinder, or a very narrow ellipse like this. So if you're seeing a little bit of the bottom

  • plane, that cylinder would look like this, right? Very flattened ellipse at the bottom

  • suggests that we're looking at the rounded portion of the cylinder.

  • If you do a very round ellipse, it's suggesting that we're looking at the cap, and that it's

  • pointing away from us. So in here, basically instead of drawing a circle, you would do

  • something like this, right? In here, for these two guys, you have the right idea. The flatness

  • of the ellipse should be about that much. We're looking right at the caps; it's facing

  • away from us. However, it's the angle of the ellipse that's wrong in this one. This one

  • looks good, but this one is now angling this way for some reason. It should be just angling

  • this way. It should be perpendicular to the long axis of the spine.

  • So let's say we have... I'll just draw it bigger on the side. Let's say this is the

  • spine in that cervical section. So that's this entire area. You've got this one correct,

  • but then in here, you did this, curving this way. Since the long axis is this angle, the

  • perpendicular oval would be this, okay? So just watch the angle and the flatness. Really,

  • when you're doing a cylinder, there's only a few things you need to make sure you get

  • right: the ellipse of the caps, make sure that the angle is correct, and make sure that

  • the flatness or roundness is correct. The other thing, is that you just make sure that

  • you connect the top and bottom with straight lines. And there you go, you've got a cylinder.

  • Not many things to look for in a cylinder, so make sure when you draw a cylinder, that

  • all those things are correct. Okay, let's move on to Juan Pablo Lopez Arenas.

  • So what I wanted to say on these, is actually something I see a lot of people doing, and

  • that's the connection of the lumbar section to the pelvis, or to the sacrum, really. It

  • should connect to the sacrum, but you're connecting it to the pelvis, to the bucket of the pelvis.

  • And what I mean by that is, let's say in this one for example, the middle one, the center

  • line is right about there, I guess. And so you're putting the connection of the spine

  • right in the middle, which tells me that you're connecting the lumbar spine to the top plane.

  • You're ending it right there. Let's say if we're just looking directly at the pelvis

  • from the front, it'd just looks like this, right? It's a bucket. We're looking right

  • at it.

  • You are connecting the spine right there. You're ending it right at the plane. That's

  • not the case. The spine actually goes about one third of the way down. So if you divide

  • into three parts, it's going to go all the way down here. And it's not going to face

  • up; it's going to tilt forward. Because remember, the sacrum tilts towards the front plane a

  • little bit. Maybe I'm tilting it too much in this angle. And so the spine, we will see

  • an ellipse for the bottom cap, because from the side, we're seeing this for the lumbar

  • section. So always make sure that when you're drawing it through, you go past the top plane.

  • It might look like the spine is no longer in the middle. It'll look like it's off set

  • to the left, but that's just going to be an illusion. You can draw a line if you want,

  • to indicate that you're just extending it a little bit farther. So I'm seeing that being

  • true for all of yours, all six of these.

  • The other thing I want to point out is in this one, you lost the foreshortening effect.

  • You gave it too much distance between the rib cage and the pelvis. And I don't see that

  • as a reoccurring issue with yours. So I think you understand the distance between them,

  • you just messed up because of foreshortening. So let's say, back to the bean lesson from

  • the figure drawing course, you've got the rib cage and the pelvis, and they're just

  • stacked right on top of the other. If we were all of a sudden to jump up and look down at

  • the bean and the pelvis, they would overlap. You would get the rib cage here and the pelvis

  • behind it, because now we're looking up and this is the top. Let's say this is the North

  • Pole of the rib cage. And we would see this sort of thing. So that's what you lost in

  • this one. There should be an overlap between the bucket and the rib cage, okay?

  • The next one is for Nick. Okay, I apologize. Nick Kulynycz, Kulynycz. The only thing I

  • actually wanted to point out with Nick's, is how he posted this on Facebook, this image.

  • And then in the comments, I told him what to correct. He said, "Okay, I'll fix it."

  • And then he posted the same thing with the corrections. So he went back and he actually

  • fixed it. He worked on the mistakes. I just wanted to point that out as an example of

  • somebody that's practicing in the right way.

  • If you watched my video on Deliberate Practice, The Secret to Getting Good Fast, I talk about

  • how important it is not just to do a lot of drawings, but to do drawings, analyze them,

  • find the mistakes, and then redo them correctly. If you just keep doing the same things wrong,

  • you're not really going to get better. You're just going to reinforce the same mistakes.

  • So it's very important to correct the mistakes, especially when somebody in the community

  • points it out, and somebody that is trustworthy, somebody you think is giving you good advice.

  • Go and fix it. It'll show that you're serious about it, and it'll help you improve. So thank

  • you, Nick, for setting a very good example.

  • Raphael Ventura, very nice, very nice drawings. I think you can push the gesture more. I think,

  • very noticeable on this one, you can see how it really pushes back in here. You can see

  • a straight forcing the upper back this way, and then this really curving back this way.

  • And so this curve, this really extreme curving in here is important for the gesture. What

  • I feel you did was straighten things out a little bit. You see how this goes up and then

  • this goes over? So this one, I guess the top portion of yours is fine, because it's very

  • horizontal. But then I feel like you needed to push the spine out more so that it's out

  • like this, and then it can go back in to the pelvis to really show the roundness of that

  • spine.

  • With this one, the same thing; it's the gesture. Your spine looks almost like a straight line,

  • right? This is a straight line from the top to the bottom, and it almost matches your

  • spine. When I look at this, the gesture I'm seeing is like that. Now, the thoracic section

  • doesn't curve out like that; it curves the other way. But the gesture, the motion throughout

  • the entire spine is like this. This points that way, this points that way, whereas your

  • gesture indicates more of just this. So what I would do is make the cervical section more

  • horizontal up to here, and then the thoracic will obviously curve a little bit more this

  • way. And then the lumbar will really curve like this. And so that will show more of that

  • curve, more dynamic gesture. All right, guys, thank you very much for joining

  • me. Thank you for all who submitted your assignments. And thank you for all of you participating

  • in the course. I am really enjoying this course so far. It's very difficult, there's so much

  • stuff to cover, but it's a challenge I'm really enjoying. And it's great to have such a good

  • community of students to teach this to. So thank you very much for being there for me.