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Hey, it’s Marie Forleo and you are watching MarieTV, the place to be to create a business
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and life you love. Now, if you know anything about me you know that I love food and I’m
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also Italian. And today I want you to meet one of my favorite chefs. I cook out of her
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cookbooks more than any other. But don't get me wrong, this episode is not just about food,
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it’s about taking risks and going against the grain and doing whatever it takes to make
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your dreams come true.
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Breaking onto the culinary scene as the first vegan chef to capture the top prize on Food
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Network’s Cupcake Wars, Chloe Coscarelli has since been turning heads bringing mouthwatering
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vegan dishes to the mainstream. Chloe is the author of two bestselling books, “Chloe’s
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Kitchen: 125 Easy, Delicious Recipes for Making the Food You Love the Vegan Way” and “Chloe’s
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Vegan Desserts: Over 100 Exciting, New Recipes for Cookies and Pies, Tarts and Cobblers,
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Cupcakes and Cakes, and More.” And now her new book, “Chloe’s Vegan Italian Kitchen.”
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Chloe honed her culinary skill at the Natural Gourmet Institute in New York City and holds
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a plant based nutrition degree from Cornell University. Chloe has appeared on Food Network’s
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Cupcake Wars, the Today Show, CNN, has been featured in the New York Times, the Oprah
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Magazine, Rachael Ray, Martha Stewart’s Whole Living, Star Magazine, and Shape.
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Chloe. I’m so excited to have you on MarieTV.
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Yay, happy to be here.
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So you, in my opinion, are one of the best vegan chefs out there and one of the things
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I so admire about you is that you said your goal isn’t necessarily to convert people
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to veganism, but just to show them that you can eat healthfully and eat whole foods and
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it can be incredibly delicious. Tell us a little bit about your philosophy that way.
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Well, I obviously love vegan food. I think it’s delicious. So it’s my goal to show
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people that, hey, this food is actually good and it can make you feel satisfied and it’s
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not something that you have to commit to 100% of the time if you’re interested in it.
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So I like to think of it not as an all or nothing. You’re either an extreme vegan
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or you’re nothing. I like to think that you can eat vegan once in a while, maybe once
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a week start incorporating it into your dinner table, and you can start getting used to it
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and maybe you start to like it.
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Yeah. I love that and I love that nonjudgmental approach because it really does invite people
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in to try new things and to not feel bad if they can’t maintain something 100% of the
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time.
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Right. I can’t tell you how many times people say to me, “Oh, you’re vegan. I could
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be vegan, but I love bacon too much, so I could never do it.” I’m like, “Well,
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you can still eat bacon if you want. Try eating vegan a little and see how it makes you feel.”
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Yeah. So when I learned that you were the first vegan chef to win a major food network
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competition, it was Cupcake Wars, and you did that when you were all of 22. I was like,
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this chick is amazing. So tell me, how did you even learn about that competition? And
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what was that thought process like for you to go, “You know? I want to throw my hat
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in the ring. Should I do this? Shouldn’t I do this?” How’d that whole thing go?
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So I was fresh out of culinary school and I was just browsing Twitter and I saw a casting
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call for Cupcake Wars and so I was like, “Oh, I’ll go try out. Why not?” And then they
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cast me on the show and I was kind of taken by surprise, so I actually called the producers
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back and I was like, “I just wanna remind you that my cupcakes were vegan. Did you catch
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that? Is that still ok? Can I still come on the show?” And they were like, “Yeah,
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it’s totally fine. Come on down.” So it was definitely surprising for me but it just
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kind of all happened, all worked out.
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Now, did you have in your mind when you thought, you know, you saw that casting call, did you
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think, “Oh my God, this is my chance to get my brand out there,” or was it more
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about the actual challenge of being in a cooking competition? Because those things can be really
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intense. I love watching those shows, so I know it’s reality TV so they increase the
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drama factor a bit. But what was that inner drive for you about wanting to go for this?
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Yeah. I’m, like I said, I graduated culinary school and I really didn't know what I was
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doing at all. I felt like I had zero direction. I… when I graduated college I decided to
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go to culinary school because I wasn’t really sure what else I wanted to do, but I knew
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I liked to cook. And then when I was in culinary school I was like, “Ok, well, if anything,
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I’ll learn how to cook,” but I didn't really have any strong ambitions for afterwards.
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So I was just looking for ways to get my food out there. I knew what I loved, but I didn't
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know what I could do with it. So it was like… it was a journey to get to this place, but
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I think that Cupcake Wars was a great opportunity because I was like, “If I can show people
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that vegan cupcakes taste better than regular stuff,” it’s always about, “Oh, does
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it taste as good as the ‘real thing,’” but I’m like, “No. This is my chance to
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show people that it can actually taste better.” So it was really exciting.
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That’s awesome. When I was watching the bit where you won Cupcake Wars, it was so
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fascinating to me because I feel like you can learn a lot about how people behave in
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situations, especially when they’re under pressure. And I was so impressed that you
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kept your composure and that the person that I’ve known from afar through your cookbooks
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and your videos and online, you were still so kind and you were still so sweet, but you
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were very, very focused on getting things done. And then I know there was those other
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clips where, you know, where people, they talk a little smack, and I’m sure sometimes
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the producers help to make that happen because they wanna, again, heighten that drama factor.
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Did you feel intimidated by the other chefs? Again, because there was the issue, of course,
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vegan was different at that time. And, of course, your age. You were much younger than
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a lot of the other contestants. Did that feel like you were on unequal footing? Or what
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was that experience like?
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I did hear people talking behind the scenes saying like, “Oh, you know, she’s doing
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vegan cupcakes so she’ll be out in the first round.” And I remember just thinking, “How
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can you say that when you haven’t even tasted it?”
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Yeah.
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Yeah. So, I don't know. It was good I think because sometimes when you hear a lot of naysayers,
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it… it makes you really reach into a place inside of you that knows you can do it.
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Yes.
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So sometimes when people are really encouraging, I’ll be the one to start being like, “No,
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I can’t do it. I can’t do it.” But then when someone else starts saying, “You can’t
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do it,” that’s when I’m like, “Ok, I think I can do this.” You know? So it
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helped me really just stay focused and do my thing and realize I’m not gonna listen
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to any negativity around me. Just gonna make cupcakes.
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That was awesome. And when you won I just thought it was so brilliant. You did such
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a killer job.
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Oh, thanks.
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For your journey after that, so that was this big win, it was amazing. Have you found yourself
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finding other hurdles or difficult parts and continuing to build your career as a vegan
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chef?
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Mmhm. Well, I think, as you know, for any entrepreneur it’s always like what’s next?
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So this was great, but where am I going from here? And I feel like at every point in my
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career I never really know the answer to that question. So that unknown is something that’s
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so unsettling that can creep up on me in the middle of the night and I’m like, you know,
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“So I’m turning in this book. What’s my next book?” But it’s just something
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you have to learn to deal with and, yeah. There’s so much to learn. I think I’ve
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also learned a lot about, like, a lot of people say being an entrepreneur is… the hardest
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part about it is that you have to have so much self discipline because you don't have
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a boss standing over you. But I think for me actually I have the reverse problem where
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I’m, like, too much of a boss on myself sometimes, so I need to learn when to, like,
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chill out.
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I have that problem.
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Yeah.
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I think there’s many of us, especially when you love what you do.
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Yeah.
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And you really, really love it, you know, it becomes an obsession, it becomes the thing
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that you wanna do all the time.
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Yeah.
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I think you had an interesting experience, right, working on this book.
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Yeah. When I was… when I was working on the final manuscript for my latest book I
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was like, “I have 300 pages to get through and I’m on a flight, international flight,
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home from Italy. Let me try to finish all of this on the flight.” And then my mom…
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I was with my mom at the time. She was like, “Why don't you just relax and sleep? You
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know, we’re on a flight, it’s dark.” My light thing wasn’t working. I was like,
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you know, “I don't care, my light thing’s not working. I’m gonna get this done.”
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And we hit a little bit of turbulence and the next thing I knew I blinked and my entire
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300 page manuscript went flying, like making it rain, all over the cabin and I was like,
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“Is this actually happening to me?” And I just stormed up and down the aisles, like,
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trying to reorder it and collect it and I was so upset. And my mom was like, “Ok,
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now will you just take a nap?” and, you know, like, forget about it. I’m like, “Yeah.”
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So I think something that I learned is, like, if I don't give myself breaks, then the entrepreneur
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gods will step in and give them to me for me. So I try to build in breaks to my daily
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routine.
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It’s important. I mean, I try and do the same thing but it doesn't always work.
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Yeah.
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And there’s oftentimes when my body has just said, “You know what? You’re gonna
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get sick right now.”
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Right?
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“And you’re just gonna…”
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So that you can just stay in bed and relax.
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Totally.
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I’m like, “Alright, I’ll take it.”
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So the reason that I became obsessed with you in the first place was I got, I believe
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it was your first book, Vegan’s… Chloe’s Vegan Kitchen. And you have your avocado pesto
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pasta, which is one of my favorite things ever and it’s now… Josh is obsessed with
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it.
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So glad. So I’ve made it a million times and when
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you and I got together a few months ago and I learned about your obsessive nature with
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testing your recipes, I was just so impressed. So tell me what that’s about for you. Why
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are you so committed to having these recipes be just ideal?
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So writing a cookbook is so much more than having good food. It’s about allowing your
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food to make it to somebody else’s table who lives across the country exactly as you
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wanted it to be. So it’s all about making it accessible and easy and inviting so that
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people can try it and they’re gonna have good results. I had an experience when I was
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younger with my mom. We were cooking out of a book and she let me, you know, “Pick out
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anything you wanna make.” So you look at the pictures and I’m like, “Ok, I want
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this one.” It was this chocolate cake tower that was beautiful. I was like, “I wanna
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make this.” And me and my mom set out to make it and by the time we were done it was,
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like, the picture was this beautiful chocolate cake tower and ours was like this pile of,
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like, broken cake crumbs. It was, like, dirt. Like something that you would find in the
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trash. And I remember just feeling so tricked by the book. I was like, “This is what it’s
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supposed to look like. We followed the directions. What happened?” And so I knew I never wanted
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people to feel that way when they’re cooking out of my book. I want them to feel a sense
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of accomplishment. So I work really hard on testing the recipes, like, at least 50 times
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each recipe to make sure that it’s perfect and that it’s easy to recreate.
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Yeah. That’s the thing, that’s why your cookbook is actually the one I cook out of
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nearly the most because even if I’ve never tried that one before, I know it’s gonna
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be a home run. And I think the other thing that you do so well is you make it accessible.
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There’s not a million ingredients. And almost all the time I have everything in my pantry
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or I can run out to the farmstand or run out to the grocery store and get a few of the
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fresh ingredients and whip it all up. Was that something that frustrated you when you
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were younger? Like, just these wild ingredients in cookbooks?
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Yeah, all the time. When I’m writing a cookbook, usually the first step is I’ll cook all
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my recipes and have, like, a taste testing party. And I invite friends and family and
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I make everything. And if there’s a dish that people say, “This is delicious, it’s
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perfect,” that is actually where the process begins for me because I’m like, “Ok, we
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know it tastes good. Check. Now, how can I work with this recipe and cut out some ingredients
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that maybe don't need to be in there? How can… do I really have to steam the tempeh
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first? Can I cut out a step?” Because I know if the recipes aren’t easy, easy to
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shop for, inexpensive, and easy to make, busy people are not gonna have time to make them.
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So that’s usually a big process of trial and error and it… I can test each recipe
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up to 50 times just testing it once, making a change, testing it again, making another
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change. So it’s actually a very scientific process.
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That’s so awesome. Thank you for doing it, because it really does pay off. Now I wanna
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talk about your new book, which is, y’all, this is… check this out. I was so excited.
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When your mom told me that this was your next book, Chloe’s Vegan Italian Kitchen, I was
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like, “How is she gonna do this? How is she gonna make Italian food vegan and delicious?”
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150 pizzas, pastas, pestos, risottos, and lots of creamy, Italian classics. This, I’ve
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already started cooking out of it. I’ve done at least 3 recipes and they’re killer.
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What inspired you to write this book?
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So with a last name like Coscarelli I thought it was a natural fit. I love pasta, I just
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love carbs in general in any form, so this was a book that was very close to my heart
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and I have so many great family recipes. My dad’s family has a ton of Italian heritage
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and culture and it was just wonderful to be able to take some of those family heirloom
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recipes and be like, “I’m gonna veganize them.” Because they’re original at that
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point. So I also think that I get a lot of people that say, “Oh, you can’t eat Italian
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food because you’re vegan. What do you do about the cheese?” And so I really wanted
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to show people that, actually, you can eat delicious, authentic Italian food veganized.
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That’s awesome. So I know, which I’m so excited about, I’ve been dreaming about
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this. You’ve brought some things from the cookbook for us to taste today. And, by the
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way, y’all, we have recipes from Chloe’s book below so you can try some of these at
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home. So ladies?
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Yay.
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Oh my God. Ok, so, Chloe, tell us a little bit about what we are about to taste.
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Thank you.
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Oh my goodness. Ok, now this is what I couldn’t wait to see.
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Thank you.
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Do you guys… can you see this? Oh my God. Ok, I’m gonna shut up and let you talk.
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Ok, we’ve got meatball sliders, vegan meatball sliders. So these are not like the frozen
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meatballs that you can buy in the grocery store that have no vegetarian. These are handmade
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meatballs and they’re so easy. They’re made out of mushrooms and brown rice as the
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base and then just like a ton of spices and garlic and onion and flavorings and delicious.
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And we’ve got them on a tomato sauce with a little bit of cashew mozzarella on top so
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it’s like no cholesterol, no animal fat, easy and healthy. And then we’ve got vegan
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raspberry tiramisu cupcakes, and these are actually my winning cupcakes from Cupcake
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Wars that I featured in my book.
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Yay! Oh my God.
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Help yourself.
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This has been the thing that I’ve been so wanting to try. Oh, Zachy. Thank you so much.
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So, sorry guys. I know sometimes it’s not fun to watch people eat, but you’ll probably
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see our expressions when we eat the actual vegan meatball sliders. Oh, my goodness. Oh
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my God. Sorry. You guys, recipe is below. This is absolutely delicious.
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Good, I’m so glad you like it.
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These are perfect for a party.
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Mmhm.
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You could probably do these with spaghetti and meatballs as well.
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Yes, you can use the meatballs, you can make sub sandwiches, you can top it on any kind
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of pasta. And this is just one of, like, so many different ways that you can do Italian
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food vegan.
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Ok, I’m going right for dessert. Is that terrible? Am I horrible? And, you guys, don't
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think I’m torturing my team here, because they’re actually gonna get to taste some
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right after. So this is our tiramisu…