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  • Hey everybody.

  • A lot of you have asked me about my please do not touch sticker

  • on my computer.

  • And so today we're going to talk about just that.

  • I have with me Richard McCoy, who's

  • trained as an art conservator.

  • But now he works on sort of general architectural

  • conservation preservation.

  • Is that about right?

  • I like to say cultural heritage.

  • And that's kind of a funny word, but it captures most

  • everything.

  • So Richard, I said you were trained as an art conservator.

  • But what is an art conservator?

  • RICHARD MCCOY: Art conservators are kind

  • of the art doctors in a museum.

  • They are the folks that work to restore paintings,

  • to fix sculptures, to take care of costumes and textiles.

  • They're the folks that get to touch

  • the artworks in the museum and to try

  • to make them look better.

  • So you're the person who has to deal with it,

  • when other people do touch things they shouldn't.

  • That's right.

  • I used to be a curator in a museum.

  • And I had a stack of stickers that said, "please do not

  • touch" in my drawer.

  • And every time somebody would touch

  • something they weren't supposed to in the museum,

  • I'd get a call.

  • And then I'd sort of scamper up to the galleries

  • and put it down, as a first line of defense.

  • Just before we put up a barrier, let's ask them nicely.

  • Please don't touch.

  • I put the sticker on my computer because I thought it was funny,

  • and because I didn't want people to touch my computer.

  • But it's also indicative of a wider trend of mixed messages

  • out in the art world.

  • Where they tell you you can't touch it,

  • but sometimes you can.

  • It's confusing.

  • So Richard, let's go through a bunch of artworks

  • and say whether we can touch them and we can't touch them.

  • How about it?

  • Great.

  • This is going to be fun.

  • Let's figure out what we can touch.

  • SARAH URIST GREEN: OK, here is a large outer sculpture

  • by Henry Moore, outside the National Gallery in Washington.

  • Can touch or can't touch?

  • RICHARD MCCOY: Well, it's made of bronze.

  • And if you were to go up and touch it,

  • maybe your little fingers wouldn't do a lot to it.

  • But then imagine 1,000 people doing that, every single day.

  • Next thing you know, there'd be this big gigantic swipe

  • mark on it, from everybody touching it.

  • So to help it last longer, don't touch.

  • SARAH URIST GREEN: OK, next up, Marcel Duchamp's bicycle wheel.

  • Can touch or can't touch?

  • RICHARD MCCOY: Do you mean, can you

  • go up and just sort of spin the wheel?

  • SARAH URIST GREEN: You want to.

  • RICHARD MCCOY: No.

  • SARAH URIST GREEN: No.

  • RICHARD MCCOY: I mean, I think that's part

  • of the fun of this piece is that it's a bicycle wheel.

  • And you know it moves.

  • And so you're just dying to go up and spin it.

  • But you can't.

  • I mean--

  • SARAH URIST GREEN: And it's an everyday object.

  • So it sort of feels like you should be able to touch it.

  • Again, it's not so bad if just you touch it.

  • But imagine 1,000 people spinning that wheel every day.

  • It'd be bad.

  • It'd be bad.

  • It wouldn't last very long, and then you'd destroy the artwork.

  • Don't touch.

  • How about this earthwork by Nancy Holt, "Sun Tunnels?"

  • RICHARD MCCOY: Yeah, you've got to get in there.

  • You have to touch it.

  • You have to interact with it and see how the light works.

  • It's called "Sun Tunnels," and so you want to be in there.

  • That's one that was designed for people to touch.

  • Hardly anythings going to happen.

  • It's going to last a long time out there in the environment,

  • and there's not a lot that you can do to it to damage it.

  • SARAH URIST GREEN: Next let's look

  • at this Jasper Johns piece.

  • Seems like you might be able to touch it.

  • Can I touch it?

  • RICHARD MCCOY: Oh man, like you want to go up and just,

  • like, turn that light switch on, make that flashlight go

  • and make it work.

  • SARAH URIST GREEN: But I'm guessing no.

  • RICHARD MCCOY: Yeah, no.

  • I mean, I don't even know how that flashlight's

  • attached to the painting.

  • If you go up and touch it, you know it might pop off there.

  • I mean, I think part of the mystery of this piece

  • is allowing you to sort of imagine what it would

  • be like with the light working.

  • And so it's asking you to do some work when you go see it.

  • But in the end, you can't touch it.

  • SARAH URIST GREEN: Next up is Valie Export's "Tap

  • and Touch Cinema."

  • It's a piece from 1968.

  • And you have to touch.

  • She's inviting you to touch.

  • She's made a cardboard box theater around herself.

  • And you are invited to stick your hands

  • in, through the curtain, and touch her naked torso.

  • Must touch.

  • RICHARD MCCOY: OK, so here's one that I think a lot of people

  • ask about, is Donald Judd.

  • He's sort of famous for these really high end finishes.

  • But in the end, no way, sorry.

  • SARAH URIST GREEN: Why not?

  • RICHARD MCCOY: Well, this is a really sensitive surface

  • that are usually in unfinished metal.

  • And so if you touch them once with even just

  • kind of a greasy fingerprint, it's

  • going to leave that fingerprint there.

  • And if it's not immediately wiped off,

  • it'll eventually etch into the metal.

  • Ugh.

  • An artwork that I would really like to discuss

  • is Ai Weiwei's "Sunflower Seeds" at the Tate Modern

  • that was in Turbine Hall.

  • And if I remember correctly, you were supposed

  • to be able to walk on it.

  • But then they had to change their tack.

  • Do you remember what happened?

  • RICHARD MCCOY: That was a really interesting project.

  • I really loved that piece.

  • And you were originally supposed to walk out on it.

  • But in the end, as people were walking

  • on those individual sunflower seeds, they were crushing them.

  • And the paint and dust was coming up,

  • and it became a health hazard.

  • It actually became dangerous to people's lungs.

  • So sometimes artists and museums have to change their approach.

  • They're just looking out for you.

  • A lot of times, museums aren't trying to be a buzzkill,

  • but they're trying to keep the artwork safe,

  • and they're trying to keep you safe.

  • And they have to be responsive to the way things

  • change and the way you interact with it.

  • Can we talk about one of my favorite pieces?

  • Of course, of course.

  • What is it?

  • Great.

  • I love Felix Gonzalez Torres.

  • Me too.

  • And one of the pieces that I like a lot

  • is the candy spill, which is a pile of candy that's

  • usually in a corner.

  • And it's the weight of his partner.

  • And you are supposed to go and take a piece of it.

  • So this is one you can touch.

  • There's another one that Gonzalez Torres does,

  • this paper piece, that's usually installed

  • in the middle of a gallery.

  • SARAH URIST GREEN: It's a stack of paper.

  • And you can go and you can roll one up and take one.

  • I usually take one, and I'll tack it up

  • in my apartment or whatever.

  • As a conservator and the guy that has to go and clean stuff,

  • I see those pieces and I go take them,

  • and I wad them up into a big--

  • What?

  • Yeah, I love to do it.

  • Seriously?

  • It's fun for me in a gallery to go and trash a piece of work

  • that you're allowed to trash.

  • And so I have this crinkled piece of paper

  • that then I tack on my wall.

  • SARAH URIST GREEN: How about Dubuffet?

  • Because here's an example of an artist sometimes you can touch

  • it, sometimes you can't.

  • Here's an example of some gallery

  • based artwork, some sculptures, where

  • there's plinths surrounding the sculptures,

  • except for that one over there.

  • But the plinth is telling me do not touch.

  • Why?

  • They put the plinths up there for extra protection,

  • to keep the structures more stable.

  • In the event you did touch them, you

  • might knock them over and hurt somebody or even the artwork.

  • And so sometimes it's not just about the surface,

  • it's about stability and making sure the artwork is safe.

  • I can respect that.

  • And also the people are safe, more importantly.

  • SARAH URIST GREEN: But here's an example of a Dubuffet

  • where you can touch it.

  • In fact, you're encouraged to.

  • You have to.

  • What are we looking at?

  • RICHARD MCCOY: This is fiberglass that's

  • been painted white and black.

  • And it's a piece that was designed to be walked on,

  • even though when you walk on it, you're sort of damaging it.

  • They know that, and they're ready to repaint it every so

  • often, when it needs it.

  • So this is one that's sort of built with a maintenance

  • plan around it.

  • SARAH URIST GREEN: All right now, what about Jeff Koons?

  • These look sort of like they're in the Donald Judd category,

  • like I probably shouldn't touch them.

  • RICHARD MCCOY: Yeah, absolutely.

  • I mean, as you can see, they're on pedestals.

  • So they're really trying to keep you away from them.

  • And that's not really for a structural stability.

  • That's because they know people love to try to touch these.

  • And it's the kind of thing, if you touch them,

  • you're going to leave behind grease and fingerprints.

  • And eventually over time, that's going to trash the surface.

  • Do you have a rule of thumb of when people want to touch

  • something and when they don't?

  • It's not only the kind of material it is,

  • but it's how close it is to touch.

  • So if you could imagine, things that are sort of at arm height

  • get touched all the time.

  • But it's also shiny metal things.

  • And it's things that people want to know what they're made of.

  • So that Koons is a really good example,

  • because is it a balloon?

  • Is it metal?

  • Is it plastic?

  • What is it?

  • Can I go up and knock on it?

  • It's in a sense kind of dispelling the myth of what

  • this sculpture is.

  • That's what they're trying to play with.

  • And I think in the end to go up and touch

  • it is kind of cheating.

  • I also feel like when there's kind

  • of these perfect, pristine surfaces,

  • you kind of want to break the law.

  • You kind of do want to mess it up.

  • But you really shouldn't.

  • You know Sarah, I don't think everybody

  • wants to break the law.

  • There's rule followers out there.

  • Really?

  • And so I think part of the problem

  • is folks understanding when they can and can't touch something.

  • OK.

  • I won't touch it.

  • So I'm still kind of confused.

  • There's a lot of mixed messages.

  • How can we, as an art going public, figure it out?

  • I think being a good citizen in a cultural institution

  • is the same as being a good citizen when you're out

  • in your own town or your own city.

  • So think of the cultural institutions

  • or the religious institutions, monuments and memorials.

  • This is our cultural heritage.

  • And if we don't take care of it,

  • it won't be there for future generations.

  • That's the point.

  • Richard, thanks so much for coming.

  • This was really great.

  • And I hope everybody got a lot out of it.

  • Well, thanks for having me.

  • But you know, since I'm here, can I do a mini art assignment?

  • Sure.

  • OK, so here is your extra credit art assignment.

  • What I want you to do is to go out and find something

  • that you really want to touch that you're not allowed to.

  • Don't touch it, but take a picture of it.

  • And then tell us why you want to touch it.

  • [MUSIC PLAYING]

  • Oh right I've been thinking about this.

  • Keep it clean, you all.

Hey everybody.

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