15 Secrets to Confidence in Any Situation with Voice Coach Caroline Goyder #BeBoldForChange

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(upbeat music)
- Hello everyone and welcome back to English With Lucy.
Today I've got a very special guest.
This is Caroline Goyder.
- Hello.
- And Caroline, well would you like to introduce yourself?
What do you do?
- I'm now a voice coach, but for many year--
Well if we go back to the late nineties I was a TEFL teacher
briefly so I know this world very well.
I remember standing in front of my group
of Argentinian students to teach them English
and being utterly terrified being in the spotlight.
And now I teach people how to be in the spotlight.
- Yeah so today, we wanted to talk to you about
how to be more confident in different situations.
So we've chosen five situations,
and we're going to tell you,
or Caroline's gonna tell you how you can feel
and sound and appear more confident.
And we're doing this to celebrate International Women's Day
and their Be Bold For Change campaign.
So where were you teaching English?
- I was teaching in Gojav in north-west Poland.
Which was fantastic but a very unlikely place to go
after your TEFL training.
I loved it.
- What made you choose?
- There was a poster on the wall in my TEFL school
and I just went, oh there's a job
and so I went to Poland.
It was great, I love Poland.
It's fantastic.
- I've never been to Poland.
I have quite a few Polish subscribers so I'm sure
they would love to hear you speak some Polish.
(speaking foreign language)
- That's one word.
There's one word I know that's (speaking foreign language).
- Yup that's good that's like your prost,
that's your drinking word.
- Piwo is a good word for beer.
- Okay.
- I'm not giving any aspersions to my time in Poland.
(laughs)
- I bet you had a great time.
And so what made you go into voice coaching then?
- Well I trained as an actor, I went to drama school
and to be honest I wasn't a great actor.
- Mhm.
- And I wanted to work in theatre but I didn't want to act
so I ended up training as a voice coach
and by kinda mistake, I found a job I really really love
and once I'd trained as a voice coach,
I was like this is actually what I wanna do
for the rest of my life, it's a great job.
But I fell into it really by mistake.
- And how long have you been doing it now?
- Nearly twenty years.
- Wow so that's quite, that's some experience there.
- Makes me feel very old. (laughs)
- And I saw that you did a TED talk about confidence.
That's actually how I found you.
And how did you get into doing a TED talk?
- Well again I mean, so often these things happen
by accident.
I was coaching for TEDx in Brixton
and the very brilliant curator there Stephanie said,
have you got a talk in you?
And I said, yeah I think so.
So I pitched talks which is how you get into TEDx.
They took it on, I did it in 2014
and it's had nearly three million views which is insane.
- Wow, congratulations. - Thank you.
- That is a lot of views.
- Thank you YouTube.
- Yes thank you.
So today we're going to talk about confidence
in certain situations.
So we've chosen five situations for you.
We're going to talk about being confident at parties,
on dates, in presentations, in job interviews
and on the telephone.
So I'm really excited about this video
because so many of you have asked me to talk about
presentations, public speaking, dating
and now I've got someone extremely qualified
next to me, ready to share everything that you've learned
throughout your career.
So let's talk about parties first.
What insight do you have to share about feeling confident
whilst meeting new people at parties?
- Well so I learned a lot about this a few years back
when I was interviewing A-list actors.
Because I wrote a book which was talking to A-list actors
about confidence and I would go to people like Helen Mirren
and say, so tell me about confidence,
thinking that they knew things, that they were confident.
They weren't.
None of them were.
- Really?
- And one of the people who said she wasn't confident
was Helen Mirren.
Big surprise to me there.
- Yeah like the most beautiful woman ever, okay.
- So serene right?
- Yeah.
- And she said, when I have to go to a party after a show,
you know actors go to the bar after a show,
they have parties before launches,
all that kinda thing.
She said I get really really nervous.
And see how great tip which is the first thing
you have to do is think about your body,
you know, really relax your shoulders,
relax your breathing, centre your voice,
cause she says, I hate the way
and this is a good one for Women's Day,
you know, I hate the way that when we get nervous
as women, we kind of start screaming and shrieking
and our voices go high.
She says, keep your voice nice and low and relaxed.
- Okay.
- So I think that's a really good one.
Stay relaxed, relax your shoulders, centre your voice.
And then there are other tips,
there's a really good George Clooney one,
which also isn't--
- Did you meet him?
- No, I wish I had.
- Oh what a shame.
- He and Johnny Depp were the ones that got away.
(laughs)
His thing when he meets people is that he imagines everybody
he meets is an old friend.
- In the way he acts and speaks with them?
- Yup.
- Interesting.
- And you can just picture his face, can't you?
You know there's the muscles around our eyes
that crinkle up when we're with a friend.
- Yeah.
- It's called a Duchenne smile.
And it just relaxes us.
- Duchenne smile, okay.
- And try it, it really works.
- So you kind of close your eyes or what do you do?
- You just imagine that you've bumped into an old friend
and that you're talking to them and you let
your brain chemistry do the rest.
So just think about smiling, talking to an old friend
and how you smile at them, that's it
and then your face relaxes, your voice relaxes,
you know it's brain chemistry.
- Amazing.
I've never heard a tip like that before so really good.
- So that's number two and the third one I would say
is as you walk through the door of a party
just think, I've only got to be there for five minutes.
And this was taught me by someone who is a real introvert
and she said, it was another actor and she said,
I used to really dread parties but it's like going
to the gym and I'm not a great one for going to the gym
and if I say to myself, I'm only gonna go for five minutes,
when I get there I'm much more likely to stay
cos it's quite fun.
If you say to yourself, I'm only gonna go five minutes
and then you get there and you've had a drink
and you're enjoying itself, you're gonna stay
for a bit longer.
So just say even if you're dreading it,
I'm just gonna stay for five minutes
and find someone, talk to them as if they're an old friend
and keep your shoulders relaxed.
And you'll be fine.
- Your voice nice and low.
- Your voice nice and low, don't scream.
- Yeah that's true, I think when I'm on camera
I probably speak with a much lower voice.
And when I'm meeting new people for the first time
I would definitely say it goes up a couple of tones.
So ah, I'll be aware of that.
Okay so another big question I get is about dating
and this came up recently because I made a video
about how to say dates in English
and a lot of people were excited,
thinking I was gonna teach them about dating
but actually I was speaking about numerical dates.
So how can you be more confident whilst meeting someone
maybe for the first time or even the second time on a date?
- So I asked a friend of mine who is brilliant at dating.
And I said, what is it that you do and she said,
well actually it's something you taught me.
I was surprised by that and she said,
you taught me years ago and this is another acting tip,
that when you meet someone and you're on a date,
what you have to do you is think
and this is a real actor's tip,
you have to think I'm beautiful, someone loves me,
I have a secret.
- So these are three things?
- Three things you have to think to yourself.
I'm beautiful because it kind of gives us a little spark,
you know there are days when you're not feeling like that
and it just gives you a kind of sparkle.
Someone loves me which gives you,
it's brain chemistry again and it gives you a kind of warmth
and a presence.
And I have a secret gives you a bit of a twinkle.
- Do you actually have to have a secret?
- It helps.
- Okay, I'll try and think of one.
- It doesn't have to be Wiki leaks level.
Just you know something, actors also talk about
a naughty thought.
- A naughty thought?
I have couple of those.
- That's definitely working.
So a twinkle in the eyes and she said,
it just gives me a presence.
When I'm dating or she's going to parties as well
that makes her shine and that makes people,
it seems like you're a fun person to talk to.
Whereas so often in our head,
we've got an inner voice saying mean stuff.
- Definitely, definitely.
- We all do, we all have it.
- Before I go out for a date, I don't date much,
but when I do, I always look at myself in the mirror
beforehand and I think, well that's not right
and maybe he won't find me funny.
But I guess if I think about all the good things first.
- Exactly.
- And recognise those.
- And this relates to another acting tip
that someone taught me which is that
if you're worrying about how it might go wrong,
don't do that.
Worry about what it'll be like when it goes right.
So if you visualise yourself on the date having fun,
laughing, looking really relaxed, getting on with each other
you're gonna walk into the room much more relaxed.
And that sets a really good cycle up.
- So it's keeping yourself positive
and only thinking about all the positive parts.
Okay.
- It's the inner game.
The inner game of dating.
Says the married woman. (laughs)
- Okay what makes a good dater though?
I'm concerned for your friend, does she go on a lot
or does she just do the few very well?
- She does the few very well, I should say this yes.
- Okay. (laughs)
Maybe she's watching, hello.
- Hi Nikki. (laughs)
- So what about tip number three?
- So number three is that when we're on a date
we feel like we have to talk and talk and talk and talk
and actually you don't.
I'd say the best daters are people who are really good
at asking questions.
- And then listening, I imagine.
- And that's a real introvert tip.
I mean I'm an introvert and if I go to a party.
I'm not dating anymore, if I go to a party.
And I meet people and I'm feeling shy
I just ask loads of questions.
- Actually that's something I learned teaching
because I used to run conversation classes.
And you just have the shyest students.
But once you start asking them about themselves,
they feel important and then suddenly
they've got a lot to say.
So I guess that's good to avoid if you have
an awkward silence which is what we dread most
in dating really and meeting new people.
Asking some, having a set of good questions
prepared probably.
- Partly yes, I think if you have two or three
starter questions then really listen
and just do great follow up questions.
So if they say, I really love Seville.
Say, oh great, where did you go in Seville?
And then if they say well, there's a great tapas bar,
you know, tell me about tapas, I've never had it.
You just follow the thread of the conversation
and you just turn what they say into another great question.
- And then you show you're engaged
and that you've been listening which is important
because sometimes you're having a conversation with someone
and you can see their eyes glaze over a little bit.
- And that's horrible.
- Yeah it's the worst.
- And it will kill any spark, so having to really listen
because you're gonna ask a great follow up question
is really powerful because they feel that
they have that connexion.
- Wonderful, thank you for those tips.
So next I'd like to ask you about public speaking
and giving a presentation.
Because a lot of my subscribers are at university
or they work in jobs where they'll have to present
to big groups of people in a second language,
which is a really really tough
because public speaking, I find it difficult
in my own language.
And doing it in a second or even third language is tough.
So do you have any tips for my subscribers?
- That I mean that is really hard.
As you say public speaking is bad enough
and doing it in a language where you don't feel safe,
where you don't feel if you go wrong you can escape
is really scary.
So the things I always say to people are firstly,
if you're doing in a language that's not your first
you've got to practise twice as much.
So when I talk to clients about rehearsing presentation,
I'll say to them, take your phone.
Find voice notes on your phone and record it.
- Now that is the tip I really gel with
because when I speak in my second language which is Spanish,
I will record myself and then I'll listen back to it
and I'll notice loads of mistakes that I didn't realise
I made at the time.
And also you get to know it better.
- Exactly.
- But I feel a natural inclination to avoid practising .
Is that something you feel as well?
- That's human, that's so human.
- Why's that happen?
- We don't want to practise because it's kinda onerous,
it feels a bit unpleasant,
we don't like hearing our own voices but you really,
it's like going to the gym again.
You know, if you wanna get fit you really have to
get out there and go for a run.
It's like before you go for a run
you just have to motivate yourself
to put the recorder on and practise.
And as you say when you practise
you hear what's working and hear what's not
and you learn it.
And so I say to clients who are English,
practise it three times like that if it's important.
If English isn't your first language
I'd say you probably need to practise it six times.
For it to feel okay on the day.
- Yeah cos when you have something practised,
it kinda just comes out more easily.
So I really agree with that one.
What about tip number two?
- Tip number two is that you've got to get the body relaxed
and prepared so it's what I call getting the butterflies.
- You got me moving there.
- Breathing and grounding.
The butterflies have to fly in formation
so you know in English we say you get butterflies
in your stomach.
- Yes that's a great idiom.
If we're nervous and you feel that funny feeling
in your tummy, we call it having butterflies.
So you're saying that we need to get our butterflies
in formation.
- Like red arrows, like the planes that fly in formation.
- So you need to take hold of those butterflies
and channel them into something positive.
- Exactly, because the idea is
I mean for performers as well, for anybody who's on stage
the adrenaline is actually a really good thing.
- Because adrenaline is a feeling that I hate.
Those nerves before a first date.
I can't stand it, because I'm normally
quite a confident person.
And I guess the feeling of feeling really nervous
and the butterflies, I don't like.
But you're saying it's a positive thing.
- It's a good thing.
- Okay.
- And that's so human, everybody feels nervous, right.
It's taking them and going,
okay I'm feeling these butterflies,
this is the feeling of my power,
cause I'm gonna stand on stage and speak.
And it's also a feeling of excitement.
Cause it's a kind of alertness, the adrenaline,
and it's gonna make you perform better
as long as you don't say, oh no, here it comes.
Now the way that performers and athletes
are taught to do this, it's a lot about how
you ground yourself and how you breathe.
So I'd say to anybody, before you do something
like a speech, don't spend three hours checking your email
or playing a game.
Do something calming.
Yoga, go for a run, go for a swim, sit quietly,
meditate if that's your thing.
Create calm because then when the adrenaline hits
your state is calm.
And so then you channel it.
If we're too wired, if we've had four cups of coffee
and we've talked to all our friends on the phone
and we've answered four emails and we've Whatsapped,
you know all of that, we're not gonna handle the adrenaline.
So get quiet.
Get into the body and then you'll be alright
when the butterflies hit.
You'll get them flying in formation.
- Wonderful.
Okay and what about the third tip then.
- The final tip is when you walk out on stage,
when you face the audience, you have to see them
as old friends.
So it's a bit like the George Clooney tip.
And what I do when I have an audience
is I'll spend a little bit of time at the beginning
before the show goes up as it were, before the show starts,
before I speak, I'll go and talk to people in the audience
and I'll find out from maybe three people
what they want, why have they come today,
what are they interested in.
If I can't do that, I'll actually ask the audience on stage
does anybody have any questions.
- I saw you do this in your TED talk.
And I thought it was a really interesting thing to do
because I haven't seen anyone else do it before.
And so that's interesting to know the reasoning behind it.
And how does make you feel when you speak to the people?
- So for me as an introvert,
what's scary is feeling that everybody's looking at me.
That's a horrible feeling.
But if I'm curious about the audience,
if I'm thinking how can I help the audience
get what they want I'm not thinking about me anymore
and then I'm in what's called a flow state
and then it's just like having a chat.
It's just like us sitting here now having a chat.
That's how you wanna be on stage,
it just happens there's a thousand people in front of you.
(laughs)
And if you've spoken to a few of those people
you have a sense of why they're there
and then you forget yourself.
- And you have a role, a purpose, it's not just you being
on stage, look at me, yay.
- I couldn't speak if I thought it was about me.
But when I stepped up for the TEDx, it wasn't about me.
It was about helping the audience get something useful.
- Wonderful.
Thank you for those, I think those ones
are particularly useful especially for me,
because public speaking is something that I'm having to do
more and more nowadays.
I did my first panel the other day and I just found that
everyone was an old timer on it and I was the first
new person and I did find it a little bit traumatic.
And I definitely could've channelled my adrenaline,
my butterflies much more efficiently.
- Go for a run or do some yoga or something beforehand.
- That's a good idea, because I went for the coffee.
- Don't have the coffee.
- No I'll ditch the coffee.
Green tea and a run.
- Lots of water.
- Right so another thing I get, lots of people
are studying English, they're trying to get exams
to then be able to get a job.
So they want English qualifications to then be able
to get a better job.
And obviously they'll have to do a job interview
so that's something I get asked about quite a lot.
Do you have any tips for those people?
- Yes and I spend quite a lot of time with people
thinking about job interviews.
Because they're horrible aren't they.
- They're the worst.
- Just they're evil.
So there are tips and tricks to help you get over
that feeling of being watched because I think
the first thing to say is you are in a job interview
and you really are being observed.
- Absolutely, every inch of you.
- There's no way,
which is is quite a hideous feeling so you firstly
just have to get yourself nice and calm and centred.
And I think that's something again,
before you walk into the room, think about
not how am I looking, but what is it
that they're looking for.
And there's an actor's tip around
when you walk into the room,
just to try and help them find the right person for the job.
Or find the right person for the course.
You are helping them make a choice.
It's not about a judgement on you,
it's about helping them think clearly.
And when you flip your attention out onto what
they're trying to do, it takes you into compassion
and it takes you out of help, everybody's looking at me,
everybody's judging me.
- Oh so you change your perspective slightly.
I like that, definitely, because you know you might not be
the right person for the job.
- [Caroline] And that's okay.
- And that's something you have to accept
and that might make rejection a little bit easier as well.
I always think if there's somebody I like,
and they don't like me back,
I always try and think, well it wouldn't have worked anyway
because I wasn't the right person.
So if we apply that to the job interview situation.
- It's the same thing.
- Yeah and that improves your confidence going forward.
- [Caroline] Exactly.
- So what about tip number two then?
- So breathing is really important in an interview.
- Breathing?
- Yup, you know you get a horrible question, don't you,
think of the moment when someone asks you
a really horrible question.
- The worst one for me would be describe your weakness
or something like that.
I hate that question but they ask it all the time.
They want to see how you respond,
so you say that I should breathe.
- Remember to breathe, now okay, so how you breathe
is important.
Because what most of us do when a really horrible question
comes is we breathe here, we go (gasp).
It's a bit extreme but it's a chest breath that's happening.
That breath is not helping you.
What you want to do is breathe into your back.
So if you notice your back ribs, just kind of feel
your back ribs.
And notice that if you breathe out,
do a little kind of blowing out birthday candles breath.
And then wait for the breath in.
And then just think about breathing into the back, exactly.
- It's softer.
- It's calmer.
- It relaxes your shoulders as well.
- It's relaxing you and it's making you seem calm
under pressure which is when people give you a job
because you seem calm under pressure.
So breathe into your back and the tip,
the secret is imagine a lovely smell.
- Oh okay.
Luckily you smell great, so that's easy to imagine.
(laughs)
- That's always useful to know.
- Sorry guys you can't smell her but she's lovely.
Right so what about the third tip then?
- So the third tip is a very serious one.
It comes from the one of the economics editors
on BBC Radio Today, BBC Four's Radio Today
which is the Breakfast Show on BBC Radio Four
which is worth listening to.
And the guy there who was the economics editor
is a chap called Simon Jack and I asked him
for the second book which is called Gravitas.
What he sees in good CEOs that he interviews,
when they come on air on Radio Four.
And he said the thing they all do is
they set out their stool.
When they answer a question, they don't launch
straight into it.
They'll say something like, so Simon, three points.
- Ah, okay.
So they'll kind of introduce,
say what they were going to say
and then say it in ordered manner.
- Exactly.
- See I get a bit of a panic, I'll try and give
as much information as I possibly can
to try and appear knowledgeable about the topic.
But you're saying it's better to just prioritise
and order.
- Exactly.
- Okay.
- I mean if the question's easy then you probably
don't have to do this but it is when the question's tricky
and you go into brain freeze, it's that moment
of three things and it forces you to structure.
- And so you need that breath to think about
the order as well.
So tip two and three go together quite nicely.
- They're synchronised, exactly.
- Okay very interesting.
Right, the last topic that we're going to cover today
is talking on the telephone.
Because my students really really struggle with listening
in English.
When they do their exams, I'm sure you've seen this as well.
Speaking will be quite high, reading and writing
will be really high, but listening is always the bit
that they struggle on and it's because
you can't read the lips, you can't read the body language
and also the voice on the telephone gets a bit distorted
so how can my students feel more confident on the telephone
because it's an essential part of life.
- Telephone calls are hard aren't they.
The whole thing that we can't see the other person.
- You can't see their reaction so you don't know
whether they like what you're saying.
- It's tricky.
The first tip for calls is another actor tip
and it was an actress called Anna Massey
who's no longer with us, she's died sadly,
but she said, when I'm on the phone to someone,
I picture them sitting on the sofa, bit like this.
Sitting at home and even if I haven't met them,
I imagine what they look like
and it's a nice imagination tip.
It helps you kind of tune into that person
and be curious and I do this even with corporate clients.
If I'm talking to someone I imagine where they're sitting,
what they're wearing, what they might look like
so that I engage with them as a real person
rather than a strange disembodied voice.
So visualise the person you're talking to
is the first one.
- Okay I like that.
And then you can kind of imagine their body language anyway
and try and listen to their voice and work out
what they're feeling in response
to what you're saying.
- Exactly, it forces us to really pay attention
which is nice.
- Yes so you don't miss anything.
- So the second tip is more of a speaking tip in a way
because it's something that partly comes
from my TEFL teaching, you know, years ago was that
one of the things that when we're speaking English
and it's something I think you talk about as well.
That helps us as listeners is emphasis.
- Okay.
- And the iambic, English has what's called
an iambic pentameter which is like Hamlet.
You know if you think of, to be or not to be
that is the question.
There's a kind of dee-dum, dee-dum, dee-dum, dee-dum.
- There's the rhythm, yes.
- And lots of languages as you know,
Spanish doesn't have that, it's a different kind of rhythm.
So when you're speaking on the phone
if you really hit the nouns and the verbs in particular,
the meaning words.
You give them a little bit of punch.
You can actually punch the words as you're talking
if they can't see you.
So hi my name is Caroline, we're going to be talking
about emphasis.
I'm hitting with my hand the important words.
If they're on the phone they won't know,
just as long as they don't forget they're on a Skype call.
- Yeah don't do it on Skype.
- That was like me with my Podcast the other day.
Really embarrassing moment, I was on a Podcast interview
and I thought it was just audio.
So I was sat there in my dressing down, a bathrobe
until I re-read the email ten minutes before
and realised it was being filmed.
So, very embarrassing.
- Modern life.
- Yeah but luckily I wasn't punching out the words.
But I should do that if I'm on the telephone.
- If they're on the telephone you can do anything.
Pretty much.
- Great and what's your final tip?
And the final tip of today actually.
- The final tip, the final tip of today
is if you are nervous about a call,
if you need to make a great impression, stand up.
- Stand up?
Okay, I always see my dad doing that.
My dad is a managing director and he's always marching
around the house on the phone.
I thought it was because he has bad knees
but maybe it's because it makes him feel more confident.
- It's powerful, I mean maybe the bad knees as well
but it's also, you know it powers up your voice,
it's easier to have a powerful voice when you're standing.
It gives you more energy, it helps you feel more relaxed.
It helps you breathe.
And it makes you sound better simply.
- Okay, yeah I actually find myself naturally
wanting to stand up and go and look out of a window
or something whilst I'm on the telephone.
So yeah I can see that working.
- And there's a final tweak to that
which is what voiceover artists do.
You know if you're voicing over a movie
like sing or something, they gesture.
So they'll be standing in a voiceover studio
and they go crazy with gestures
because what they know is that gesture orchestrates
the intonation of the works.
So if my hands are high, my voice goes high,
if my hands are low, my voice goes low.
So stand up, hold the receiver to one ear
or get yourself on speaker phone and wave your arms about
and you will ...
To match what you're saying, not just randomly,
but it will give you more power, more energy
and you'll be easier to listen to.
- Wonderful, really really good tips.
Thank you very much.
And actually if anyone who wants to take
their telephone English a bit further,
Caroline has got an audio course
all about having confidence while speaking on the telephone
and it's absolutely free.
So if you're interested in that, then there is the link
in the description box and you can check that out.
Well Caroline, it was a pleasure to have you on today.
Thank you so much, I feel like I've learned loads.
I hope you guys have learned a lot as well.
If you're interested in hearing more from Caroline,
then all of her information and social media
is in the description box
and you can also go and look at her TED talk
which has three million views now.
Amazing, she's beat me on the views for that one.
(laughs)
So yes, thank you very very much for being my guest today.
- My pleasure, thank you.
- And remember be bold for change
and make a change in your life and be more confident.
Don't forget to connect with me
on all of my social media.
I've got my Facebook and my Instagram
and I will see you soon for another lesson.
Bye!
That's it thank you guys.
(upbeat music)