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  • We talked with Ali Abdaal about his Second Brain:

  • the Idea Factory he used to build a team of 20

  • employees and a 3-million subscriber YouTube channel.

  • In this detailed walkthrough, we'll talk about the

  • four steps of Ali's Second Brain process:

  • his system for where notes go,

  • and the specific apps he

  • uses every step of the way.

  • This is Ali Abdaal's Second Brain. ?

  • First, let's start with Capture.

  • So Capture is about getting it outside of your brain,

  • social media, the world, and into some trusted single place

  • where you can start to work with it.

  • What are the different ways

  • that you capture information?

  • Okay, so many.

  • The first one is Physical Notebook. Perfect.

  • I still like Physical Notebook.

  • I kind of go between various

  • ones, depending on how I'm feeling. Recently.

  • Last week or so.

  • I've started Morning Pages.

  • So I have this other notebook where I do

  • three pages of, like, handwritten-y textuh, textuh, WRITING (both laugh)

  • And if I'm capturing notes on the fly,

  • usually I just use Apple Notes because all

  • the other apps, they kind of suck online.

  • And I'm often in for example, if I'm in a restaurant

  • and I'm in the toilet downstairs where there's no

  • signal and no WiFi, and that goes into Apple Notes.

  • That's apple notes on your phone, right? That's right.

  • Occasionally apple notes on my Mac as well.

  • It's very easy to just pop it open

  • with Alfred (app) and I have multiple folders.

  • It's basically almost like, Evernote, but

  • it's just such an easy place to just chuck stuff into,

  • and I can kind of forget about it. And I know that,

  • again, (tip from your course)

  • if I ever need to find something, I can just

  • search for it rather than having to worry about the

  • specific folder and the specific tag and all of that.

  • Generally, I do a lot of automated capture stuff. Okay.

  • So I don't have to think about it too much. Perfect.

  • So Readwise is like the center of my capture

  • system, so that if I'm reading on Kindle and

  • I highlight on Kindle, it goes into Readwise.

  • If I'm reading on Instapaper, it goes into Readwise.

  • More recently, I'm using the beta version of Readwise's

  • Reader app, which is sort of Mac web iOS.

  • So when I highlight on that, it goes into

  • Readwise, and then Readwise syncs into my Roam and

  • my Notion and all that kind of stuff

  • further down the line. I use

  • Day One as my journal app.

  • So if it's like journaling and it's

  • private, I'll turn it into day one.

  • Often, if I'm writing a daily note in Roam,

  • I'll just copy paste it into Day One anyway,

  • just because I like having the data.

  • And I've been using day one for five years

  • plus now, so it's a nice stream of daily

  • journaling, daily thoughts, that kind of stuff.

  • I do use Todoist as, like, kind ofif it's a

  • task and I want to capture it, I'll chuck in Todoist.

  • Occasionally I'll just do a voice memo,

  • But the app I use most often is Otter.ai,

  • for example, I'm having a conversation with someone and I

  • know this is a conversation that would be useful to

  • record and transcribe things, I'll just open up otter on

  • my phone trying to put it down in between us

  • and it's just doing it. Cool, isn't it? It's so cool.

  • Do you have anything for YouTube videos?

  • Clips from or transcripts from YouTube videos?

  • No, I don't really watch YouTube

  • videos for that kind of knowledge.

  • I tend to watch them all for the entertainment

  • or the oh, that's a cool transition.

  • But actually when that happens, I use an app

  • called CleanShot which lets me capture a sort

  • of screen recording and turn it into a .GIF. Perfect.

  • And so when that happens, I get that GIF and I

  • put it into a mood board for the YouTube channel.

  • Nice title and subtle entrance animation. Very cool.

  • From this masterclass by Gary.

  • I want to do this for our channel and

  • then I just send this to our editors to

  • be like, hey, this is a cool thing.

  • In my mind, when I capture something, I have

  • an idea of what I'm capturing it for.

  • So for example, I tend to use Apple Notes

  • and Roam – a combination of the two for

  • personal note taking, and also for my book.

  • But we exclusively use Notion for anything related

  • to the team, anything related to YouTube videos.

  • If for example, I have random thought in the shower

  • "Daily Highlight method for productivity", then

  • I'm thinking, okay, is it relevant for a book thing

  • or is it relevant for a YouTube video thing?

  • If it is relevant for a book thing, I'll

  • chuck it into Apple Notes or into Roam.

  • And if it's relevant for a YouTube thing,

  • I'll just chuck it straight into Notion.

  • Sometimes it's both and then it gets a bit messy.

  • But I don't think about it too hard.

  • There's no speed limit.

  • You can go as fast as you want and if you know

  • where to put something absolutely why waste the effort

  • that you just put in to decide where that goes?

  • Just put it straight there.

  • What I would question though is what happens when

  • you don't know what is the plan B?

  • Is there like a safety net where things can

  • go, like a Daily Note section or an inbox

  • where in case you don't have time to decide

  • where it goes, you can just stick it there?

  • Yeah, I usually just stick it in Apple Notes

  • and then I usually forget about it because I

  • don't actually have a solid review process.

  • The Daily Notes feature in Roam and

  • the equivalent app is surprisingly helpful.

  • May 17 I was just like, I need somewhere to put stuff.

  • I happen to have Roam with me because I

  • was on the computer and I was on line.

  • So if you don't come back to this

  • and kind of redo it, there's no penalty.

  • You don't feel bad. Didn't get to it.

  • Yesterday I had a chat with Daniel and Tristan from

  • Readwise, "Discussed Book Pitch, Read Wise and Reader

  • potential course idea course aiming for August 2022"

  • and then as I was doing that, because I've

  • been using room for a while, I was like, oh,

  • this is a course, let me make this course page.

  • Of course, probably have a good goal setting.

  • When was this?

  • I must have kind of done this course like two

  • years ago when I was getting into buying property.

  • I often talk to people who seem to think

  • they need one capture tool, one capture source, which

  • is absurd. I mean, look at this list!

  • What is the unit of output that I care about?

  • And then let's just do whatever it

  • takes to get to that as efficiently

  • and as sort of frictionlessly as possible.

  • And I think the mistake a lot of people make

  • is that they're wedded to the organization of the system

  • as if the system is a unit of output.

  • So, for example, no shade on

  • August Bradley or Marie Poulin.

  • But if you're them and you're selling a

  • course on how to use notion, then it

  • pays to have a really nice notion setup.

  • But I think people kind of overly index on oh

  • my God, august Bradley has made incredible notion set up.

  • I need to do the same rather than

  • thinking what do I actually care about?

  • Rather than have pretty money and stuff.

  • Now, step two of Ali's Second

  • Brain: Organize. So for "Organize,"

  • How I would think of this is just where things go.

  • Where do they go in terms of an app?

  • Where they go in terms of a

  • folder or a tag or a category?

  • You just want some place that you

  • know when you have the idea,

  • "We want animations for YouTube videos," like you showed us

  • with the mood board, you know where to go.

  • The thing is, a lot of these

  • "capture" sources are also "organize" sources.

  • And so, for example, Apple Notes tend to stay in

  • Apple Notes unless it is a thing that's going to

  • become a YouTube video, in which case it goes into

  • Notion because that's how we manage our YouTube videos.

  • Or unless it is a thing that's going to become

  • part of the book, in which case it either goes

  • into Roam or just stays in Apple Notes.

  • Because I've even got book folders in apple notes

  • of like all the different parts of the book.

  • These are all like various folders for various things.

  • And I often just add to these, organize them.

  • Over time, the chapter structures have changed.

  • Over time, when you're writing a book, stuff changes.

  • So I don't think about it too hard.

  • I just trust that if it's something related to the book

  • and I chuck it somewhere in this book main folder.

  • It will resurface itself when I'm

  • focusing on that relevant chapter.

  • So like Apple Note itself is

  • a bit of an organizing system.

  • Similarly, if we go back to Roam, Roam itself

  • is also I mean, I don't really organize stuff

  • in Roam particularly because I trust that the tagging

  • and the searching and stuff will resurface things.

  • So for example, if let's say I'm working

  • on chapter one of the book, I have

  • this sort of subtitles been drafted.

  • Was drafting this yesterday:

  • "May 17." "Draft." "Word Count." Quite a handy feature.

  • But I also then know that I've got a

  • bunch of other pages related to autonomy and mastery

  • and purpose and intrinsic motivation and stuff.

  • I will trust the automatic

  • organizing capabilities of the app.

  • So if something like notion is a little bit more

  • structured, we have this system, of how we work with

  • a team for all of our videos that we're making.

  • And so if I need to capture an idea I know

  • specifically it goes into this page, then Jamie, our YouTube producer

  • will specifically take the idea and put it into the relevant

  • place and decide what needs to happen with it.

  • Back when I was doing everything

  • myself, this was a lot simpler.

  • It was just basically a glorified Kanban board where

  • I could add a glance, see okay, what stage

  • of production are each of our videos at?

  • Writing or filming or editing?

  • I've got hundreds to thousands of things in my

  • Readwise database in terms of books and articles.

  • Mostly books and articles,

  • occasional tweets, occasional podcasts.

  • And this all gets rooted or routed into my

  • Roam, which is quite convenient whenever I get around

  • to refreshing the link because sometimes it doesn't work.

  • So depending on what kind of idea it is and

  • how you're going to use it, you either want it

  • in a hierarchy or you want it in a network.

  • If I'm online, I will chuck it into Roam.

  • Sometimes it's even the one to three

  • milliseconds it takes for room to load.

  • It needs to have a thing. Absolutely.

  • If I need to find something, it

  • will rock up at some point.

  • So you trust that when you read a

  • book, take a highlight, it's going to end

  • up more or less automatically in Roam?

  • Yeah, more or less automatically in Roam.

  • And if I need to revisit at some

  • point, I kind of know that it's there.

  • And what's interesting about Search, it

  • doesn't matter where something is located.

  • Have you noticed when you do a search, it

  • just finds the thing you don't know or care

  • which folder or link or tag it's part of? Exactly.

  • Yeah, I find this that often

  • I don't actually organize stuff.

  • Like this is my just general Notes

  • folder and I'm like, all of this

  • stuff should probably be organized somewhere.

  • And then I'm like, I don't really care.

  • Yes, I'll find it in search if I need to. Totally.

  • There's that nice phrase,

  • I think it's from Andy Grove, which is like

  • "Let chaos reign, then rein in chaos." Nice. Yes.

  • Whereas I think the mistake people make is that

  • they try to figure out the system first.

  • Actually, if you become chaotic first, then you'll figure

  • out what the minimum Bible level of organization is.

  • Step three is Distill.

  • So Distill is about boiling down the essence.

  • How do you start to corral, to kind

  • of survey all this different information that you've

  • saved and organized so that you can create

  • a video or a piece of writing? What

  • comes to mind? For YouTube videos, when I do distilling

  • is when we have a video that I need to write.

  • In the past, and sometimes when I have spare time

  • and I'll be like, oh, I have this idea.

  • Let me just do a little slow burner on one

  • of these 18 videos that we've got in the pipeline.

  • But now that I've got a team, it's more like this week.

  • The two videos that I care about are

  • how to Get Started with Investing and the

  • Book club episode of Building a Second Brain.

  • Let's do the investing one.

  • So once you have that lens, that kind of

  • filter, where are you going to go to find

  • basically, like, what you know about that subject?

  • Step one is my first brain, and

  • step two is my second brain proof.

  • And step three is the Internet,

  • which is the optional step.

  • This is a video I made about two years ago.

  • And I remember writing it on a night

  • shift when I was in the hospital because

  • a friend messaged me on WhatsApp saying, hey,

  • man, I want to get started with investing.

  • How do I do it?

  • And I started replying to him on my phone.

  • I was like, well, this is inefficient. WhatsApp Web,

  • WhatsApp is blocked

  • on the hospital computers.

  • And I was like, Wait a minute. Notion is not blocked.

  • So I opened up Notion, I made a tag, it tagging.

  • I made a card "how to Get

  • Started With Investing" and just started writing.

  • I was like, okay, all the advice I'm going to give

  • my friend, let me just chuck it into a Notion page

  • because I know this will be a video at some point.

  • I love that example.

  • And then that video came out, and now

  • it's got like three or 4 million views

  • and it's just done super well over time.

  • I think now that I have got a

  • more fleshed out second brain, I can think.

  • Okay, first off, let's say I'm doing a

  • video called Investing Advice for Your 20s.

  • What I'd be doing is off the

  • top of my head, what's my list?

  • What am my bullet points?

  • But also I know that I've read The Psychology of

  • Money, and I know I highlighted a bunch of stuff

  • and I know I've got a video about the book.

  • So I know that's going to be either in

  • Roam or in Notion or in my readwise Highlights.

  • I know I've read some stuff on Collaborative Fund.

  • I know.

  • I've read some other things by Morgan Housel.

  • I know I've read some stuff on Mr.

  • Money Moustache's personal finance blog.

  • Theoretically, if I just search my Roam, I may come

  • across some things which I hadn't thought of, that my

  • first brain hadn't come up with that thing. Yes.

  • And therefore, let me just chuck it into

  • this video because this is a good point. So good.

  • Look at this:

  • "December 19, 2020.

  • The rich man car paradox."

  • I actually forgotten that was a thing

  • because I read this two years ago. There you go.

  • But I've just searched "Money" in Roam. I read.

  • Oh, "psychology." Oh.

  • I actually read this as a blog post.

  • This was a blog post before I read it as a book.

  • I completely forgot about that.

  • And I've highlighted this thing at the time.

  • This would be a really interesting point

  • that I would put in the video

  • that my first brain hadn't thought about.

  • Perfect. "To generate more respect than fast cars."

  • That's nice.

  • Well played, Morgan!

  • This is what I think people don't understand.

  • And you kind of referenced it before.

  • You don't need to do new research.

  • Don't go to Google.

  • Imagine if you went to Google right now, how to invest.

  • Oh, God.

  • It would be the most pointless that some

  • content marketer for Hubspot wrote at one point.

  • It would be the worst. It would be the worst.

  • And instead of what we're talking about here, you're drawing

  • from years, even for a subject that you said yourself

  • you're not that interested in, but even a subject like

  • that, you could probably come up with ten or 20

  • pieces of content from the sources you just mentioned.

  • Step four, it's time to Express.

  • What do you do now that you've done, in

  • a sense, all this preparatory work you've captured, organized,

  • still to support, to make it easy to actually

  • just get your ideas out into the world.

  • What does that look like for you?

  • Here's how it actually go about it.

  • In fact, to be honest, this is how I would do it.

  • If it's a video that I'm just sort of

  • typing a few notes and stuff for, I would

  • actually just do it in Apple Notes.

  • What makes you go to Apple Notes versus Roam for this?

  • The way I'm actually thinking of it is

  • just quicker to write things in Apple Notes. Yeah.

  • And if I want to purchase that one on

  • the toilet or something, I don't have to worry

  • about Roam loading and being online and all of

  • the friction associated with Chrome, even though it's powerful,

  • it's, like, more annoying to deal with.

  • And so for a video like this, I think I'm

  • going to drop it out in Apple Notes, and then

  • when it's ready to go into Notion, I'll just copy

  • paste into notion so then the team can do stuff

  • with it that actually makes a lot of sense.

  • I think often when it comes to expressing, you use

  • the simplest app because the features of a more sophisticated

  • app, now when we're in convergence are now friction.

  • They're creating friction and you need to

  • just sprint towards that end product.

  • Yeah, I think that's very true.

  • I often find myself dropping a lot of

  • book chapters in Apple Notes as well.

  • So I know I just need to

  • know it's new, not worry about it.

  • And I can immediately start writing apple notes.

  • I can start typing as soon as I start thinking. Exactly.

  • Basically what we need is an intro.

  • All we need is a hook.

  • We need an intro.

  • Probably C. O. D. E. makes a lot of sense.

  • And then "productive output, note taking, capture."

  • I'm just sort of blitzing through these

  • and looking at this kind of stuff. "PARA"

  • Not a huge fan of PARA. Sorry.

  • HEY!

  • "August 21, my building second brain:

  • resources, personal notes, team projects." Okay.

  • I mean, I've just gotten rid of Evernote and

  • replaced it with Apple Notes, but that's interesting.

  • That's what I was doing two years ago. Yeah.

  • Now I am looking forhello!

  • "The capture habit." Cool.

  • From your Building a Second Brain podcast. Cool. Okay.

  • That's interesting.

  • So I've got my transcripts from this.

  • This was when I was using Airr (app).

  • That's handy. Okay. Yeah. Like this.

  • "Valuing your own idea. My perspective

  • has something to offer.

  • A bit of a leap of faith."

  • That's interesting. Beautiful. "It's the trust.

  • You know this quote that you wrote from a documentary..."

  • Oh, mate, you were on form in this podcast!

  • "I said, you can't predict that."

  • Organize, distill, express.

  • It's interesting what you do.

  • You did the first search for BASB and

  • now you're drilling down, doing more and more

  • specific searches to fill out your outline.

  • This would be how I first approach this kind of video.

  • And then I'd probably just walk around a

  • bit and be like, all right, what is

  • the actual thing that I care about?

  • I'd probably stick to the book

  • and be like, "All right, cool. What's going on

  • in 'Organize'?"

  • What would be the next stage after that?

  • What do you do with this outline? Good question.

  • So have we already... "building a second brain..."

  • Have we already got a Book Club about it?

  • Oh yeah, we do. "Book Club, Building a Second Brain.

  • There you go.

  • "Publishing date: June 15."

  • Thank you, team, for already making that happen. Boom.

  • Copy and paste into Ali's notes, as part of our notes.

  • Like we planned this or something. Yeah.

  • We also have this cool title ideas area, where

  • it automatically calculates the length in terms of characters.

  • Smart.

  • We want to keep it under 55 characters.

  • "This Book changed my approach to productivity."

  • That's a potential title. I'd be thinking about this.

  • The team would be thinking about this.

  • "How to build a second brain"

  • "My favorite productivity book."

  • Keep going, keep going!

  • (laughter)

  • Then what the team would do

  • is think about thumbnail concepts.

  • I'd be thinking, could we get, like, a little model of

  • a brain, like a little brain to put in the corner?

  • And then we would do some market research to

  • be like, all right, let's look on YouTube.

  • Building a Second Brain.

  • What's going on with that one? Oh, wow.

  • "Second Brain productivity system.

  • by Ali Abdaal." That looks great!

  • 1 million views.

  • You've got 200,000 views on what?

  • It looks like a PowerPoint presentation.

  • Okay, so that's promising.

  • So this is like janky as ****, but it's got 200K views.

  • So that's a sign that this topic lands with people.

  • Then I would chuck the content and my notes into this.

  • One of our writers

  • will take my rough first draft of what I

  • think I want to say, flesh it out into

  • maybe you want to say this as well. This as well.

  • This as well.

  • And then I'd go through and be like, yes. No. Cut. Yeah.

  • Cool.

  • We just went through all four steps to CODE.

  • Besides the actual filming, in about 30 minutes.

  • That's brilliant.

  • To build your own second brain process.

  • Sign up for the CODE Quick

  • Start guide in the description below.

  • Or if you want to start taking notes

  • immediately, watch this video on how to pick

  • your very own note taking app.

  • Sweet. Great stuff.

  • Well played everyone. GG?

  • Should we do some thumbnails?

  • Uh, yeah! Nice.

  • All right, let's stop this recording.

  • I hope it worked.

  • Ah, thank God for that

We talked with Ali Abdaal about his Second Brain:

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