BBC Learning English. I'm Neil.

And I'm Sam.

Tell me, Sam, do you think Neil Armstrong

really landed on the Moon

in 1969? I mean,

that must be fake news!

And who shot JFK? Surely the CIA

were involved? Unless it was

the giant lizards controlling

the government!

Oh dear! It looks like reading online

conspiracies has sent Neil down

the rabbit hole - an expression

used to describe a situation which

seems interesting and uncomplicated

at first but ends up becoming

strange, confusing and hard to escape

from. Luckily in this programme

we'll be hearing

some advice on how to talk

to people who've become convinced

by online conspiracies.

It seems that during times of crisis,

as people feel uncertain and fearful,

they actively

look for information to feel more secure.

Nowadays this information is often

found online, and while there are

reliable facts out there,

there's also a lot of misinformation.

Somebody who's the target of many

conspiracy theories is Microsoft's

Bill Gates and our

BBC fact checkers have been busy

debunking - or exposing - some of the

more bizarre accusations

made against him. But what strange

behaviour has Bill Gates been

accused of recently? That's

my quiz question for today. Is it:

a) being a member of the

Chinese Communist

Party?, b) being an alien lizard? or,

c) being involved in the

assassination of JFK?

They all sounds pretty silly to me but I'll

guess b) being an alien lizard.

OK, Sam, if you say so! We'll find out the

answer later. Now, I'm not the

only one who's

been doing some internet research.

Ever since the outbreak of the Covid

pandemic there's

been an avalanche of online conspiracies

linking Bill Gates to the coronavirus.

Here's Marianna

Spring, presenter of BBC World Service

programme, Trending, to tell us more:

The Microsoft founder is a rich

and powerful person and he's funded

research into vaccines

- that's why he's become a target.

Some of the claims are bonkers - that

he wants to

use the virus as a pretext to microchip

everyone in the world. Others say

a vaccine would actually

kill people rather than save their lives.

These ideas are without any evidence.

We should

treat them with the disdain they deserve.

Some conspiracies claim that Bill Gates

wants to implant microchips

in people and that he's

using the coronavirus as a pretext - a

pretend reason for doing

something that is used to

hide the real reason.

Claims like these are described as

bonkers - an informal way

to say silly, stupid or

crazy, and should therefore be treated

with disdain - disliking

something because you

feel it does not deserve your

attention or respect.

But while you might not believe

such bonkers theories yourself,

it's not hard to see how

people looking for answers can get

sucked down online rabbit holes.

So how would you deal some someone

spreading baseless conspiracies

about Covid vaccines

or Bill Gates? The BBC's Trending

programme spoke to

Dr Jovan Byford, senior psychology

lecturer with the Open University, about it.

He thinks it's important to separate

the conspiracy from the theorist.

The former, the belief,

we have to dismiss, but the latter, the

person, is more complex.

Here's BBC Trending's presenter,

Marianna Spring, again to sum up

Dr Byford's advice:

How do you talk to someone who's at risk

of being sucked into the rabbit hole? First,

establish a basis of understanding.

Approach them on their own terms

and avoid sweeping

dismissals or saying, 'you're wrong!'. Try

not to judge. And try to get to the bottom

of the often legitimate concern at the

heart of the conspiracy.

Present them with facts

and research. Try to do this neutrally.

You can't force anyone to change

their mind but

you can make sure they

have valid information.

While some conspiracies may

be harmless, others are more dangerous.

People thinking that vaccines

will kill them might worsen the

coronavirus situation worldwide,

so we need to get to

the bottom of these claims - discover

the real but sometimes hidden

reason why something

happens.

A good way to engage people in

discussion is to avoid sweeping

claims or statements

- speaking or writing about things in a way

that is too general and does not carefully

consider all the relevant facts.

And by doing so calmly and neutrally

you might persuade them to reconsider

the funny business

Bill Gates is supposedly involved with.

Ah yes, you mean our quiz question.

I ask you what Bill Gates

has recently been

accused of by conspiracy theorists.

And I said b) being an alien lizard.

But thinking about it now,

that seems pretty unlikely!

In fact, the answer was c) being a member

of the Chinese Communist Party.

OK. So today we've been hearing

advice on how to deal

with online conspiracy theories,

some of which are totally bonkers - silly,

stupid and crazy - or involve

a complicated

pretext - a pretend reason used

to hide someone's true motivation.

These can be treated with disdain - dislike

because they are unworthy

of our attention

or respect.

But with so many conspiracies online, it's

easy to get lost down the

rabbit hole - intrigued

by a situation which seems interesting

but ends up confusing and

hard to escape from.

It's important to get to the bottom

of these theories - discover the real

but hidden reason

behind them.

And to present people with facts,

avoiding sweeping - or over-generalised -

statements.

That's all for this programme.

Goodbye for now!

Bye bye!