ADVOCATES AND DRUG POLICY REFORMERS LOBBIED FOR THE DECRIMINALIZATION OF MARIJUANA, JOIN

THE DEBATE ABOUT EASING THE PENALTIES ON MARIJUANA USE.

NOW, LIVE IN OUR STUDIO, OUR HOST, DAN BOYLAN. >>DAN: ALOHA AROUND WELCOME TO INSIGHTS ON

PBS HAWAII. IM DAN BOYLAN.

A RECENT PEW RESEARCH POLL REPORTS THAT A MAJORITY OF AMERICANS APPROVE OF THE LEGALIZATION

OF MARIJUANA. THIS SHIFT IN PUBLIC OPINION WAS FORECAST

THIS PAST NOVEMBER WHEN VOTERS IN THE STATES OF WASHINGTON AND COLORADO APPROVED BALLOT

INITIATIVES LEGALIZING POT. WHILE STILL ILLEGAL FOR RECREATIONAL USE,

MARIJUANA USE FOR MEDICINAL PURPOSES IS LEGAL IN HAWAII AND 17 OTHER STATES.

HAWAII LAWMAKERS THIS SESSION DEBATED MARIJUANA RELATED BILLS THAT RANGE FROM ITS LEGALIZATION

TO REDUCTIONS OF THE PUNISHMENT FOR POSSESSION OF UP TO 20 GRAMS.

THATS 47 TO 50 MARIJUANA CIGARETTES. RIGHT?

FROM A PETTY MISDEMEANOR TO A $100 CIVIL FINE. A BILL TO TRANSFER THE MEDICAL MARIJUANA PROGRAM

FROM THE STATE DEPARTMENT OF PUBLIC SAFETY TO THE DEPARTMENT OF HEALTH IS STILL PENDING.

TONIGHT, WELL EXPLORE THE FATE OF THE PROPOSED LEGISLATION AS WELL AS EXAMINE CURRENT MEDICAL

LAWS AND MEDICAL MARIJUANAS USE IN HAWAII. WE INVITE YOU TO JOIN THE CONVERSATION BY

CALLING, E MAILING OR TWEETING YOUR QUESTIONS AND COMMENTS.

OR YOU CAN JOIN OUR LIVE BLOG. THE CONTACT INFORMATION YOU NOW SEE ON YOUR

SCREEN WILL BE SHOWN REGULARLY THROUGHOUT THE PROGRAM.

INSIGHTS IS ALSO STREAMING LIVE ON OUR COMPUTER AND WILL BE POSTED ON OUR WEBSITE AFTER THE

BROADCAST. NOW TO OUR PANEL.

PAMELA LICHTY IS THE PRESIDENT OF THE DRUG POLICY ACTION GROUP WHICH FOCUSES ON SERVES

AS A BOARD MEMBER OF THE DRUG POLICY ALLIANCE. A NATIONAL ORGANIZATION THAT PROMOTES ALTERNATIVES

TO CURRENT DRUG POLICIES. SHES ALSO ON THE BOARD OF THE DIRECTORS OF

THE AMERICAN CIVIL LIBERTIES UNION OF HAWAII. PAM HOLDS MASTERS DEGREE IN PUBLIC HEALTH.

ALAN SHINN IS THE EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR OF THE NONPROFIT COALITION FOR A DRUG FREE HAWAII,

WHICH WAS FORMED IN 1987. CDFHS MISSION IS TO REDUCE OR PREVENT DRUG

ABUSE THROUGH COLLABORATIVE EFFORTS BY EDUCATORS AND SOCIAL SERVICE PROVIDERS.

ALAN HAS SERVED ON THE HONOLULU MAYORS DRUG TASK FORCE AS WELL AS OTHER ORGANIZATIONS

ADDRESSING SUBSTANCE ABUSE. ALAN HOLDS A MASTERS DEGREE IN SOCIAL WORK.

CHARLES WEBB IS A PARTICIPATING MEDICAL MARRIAGE PHYSICIAN LOCATED ON THE BIG ISLAND AND THE

FOUNDER OF THE MEDICAL USE OF MARIJUANA CLINIC OR MUM HAWAII.

DR. WEBB ALSO PRACTICES URGENT CARE MEDICINE AND WAS AN EMERGENCY ROOM PHYSICIAN FOR OVER

30 YEARS. JAMES HOCHBERG IS PRESIDENT OF THE HAWAII

FAMILY ADVOCATES, A NONPROFIT LEGISLATIVE ACTION ARM OF THE HAWAII FAMILY FORUM.

ITS MISSION IS TO EDUCATE, LOBBY, FOR LEGISLATION AND PARTICIPATE IN THE POLITICAL ACTIVITIES

THAT ADVANCE THE INTERESTS OF FAMILIES, FAITH AND FREEDOM.

JIM IS AN ATTORNEY. WELL, IF THIS WAS THE YEAR FOR THE LEGALIZATION

OF MAYOR OF MARIJUANA, ATTA LEAST ELECTIONS IN POLLS THAT SHOW THAT OPINION FOR IT SEEMS

TO BE RISING, WHY DIDNT IT GET ANYWHERE IN THIS SESSION OF THE LEGISLATURE?

PAM, YOU WATCH THIS FAIRLY CLOSELY. >> I WATCH IT VERY CLOSELY.

FIRST OF ALL, I WANT TO SAY THANKS FOR HAVING ALL OF US HERE TONIGHT.

THIS IS A REALLY TIMELY DISCUSSION. AND WERE PLEASED THAT HAWAII IS FINALLY HAVING

A SERIOUS CONVERSATION ABOUT MARIJUANA. THE JOKING HAS KIND OF STOPPED AN PEOPLE ARE

LOOK AT IT SERIOUSLY. THERE WERE ABOUT 20 BILLS INTRODUCED THIS

SESSION. ON ALL ASPECTS OF MARIJUANA.

INDICATING THAT THE INTEREST LEVEL THAT IS OUT THERE.

AS YOU SAID, COLORADO AND WASHINGTON STATE TAKING THE BOLD MOVE TO LEGALIZE IT THROUGH

VOTER INITIATIVES REALLY KIND OF SET THE STAGE IN A LOT OF OTHER STATES ARE NOW LOOKING TO

SEE WHAT THEY CAN DO TO REFORM WHAT THEY SEE AS NONFUNCTIONAL LAWS.

16 STATES HAVE ALREADY DECRIMINALIZED INCLUDING SOME SURPRISING ONES, LIKE MISSISSIPPI, OHIO,

NEBRASKA, AND. >>DAN: WHAT DO YOU MEAN BY DECRIMINALIZE?

>> OKAY. IN SOME STATES, ITS A LITTLE BIT DIFFERENT,

BUT GENERALLY, IT MEANS REMOVING CRIMINAL PENALTYINGS FOR POSSESSION OF A SMALL A, THE

AMOUNT VARIES FROM STATE TO STATE. AROUND REPLACING IT WITH A CIVIL FINE.

CITATION LIKE A PARKING TICKET. AND USUALLY, FINE OF USUALLY $100 IS THE AVERAGE

AND ONE OUNCE IS ABOUT THE AVERAGE AMOUNT THATS PERMITTED.

>>DAN: WE HAVE NOT DONE THAT? >> NO.

WE HAVE NOT. >>DAN: IS THERE ANY  THERES NOTHING STILL

ALIVE AT THE LEGISLATURE THAT WOULD INDICATE WERE GOING TO DO IT THIS YEAR?

>> WELL, YOU KNOW, THINGS CAN HAPPEN AT THE LAST MINUTES, BUT IT LOOKS LIKE NO.

IT WENT THROUGH THE SENATE WHERE IT PASSED UNANIMOUSLY.

BILL I WILL TO DECRIMINALIZE. THEN IT OVER TO THE HOUSE, THROUGH SEVERAL

COMMITTEES ALL THE WAY TO THE FLOOR OF THE HOUSE AND THEY VOTED TO RECOMMIT IT TO COMMITTEE.

TO THE JUDICIARY COMMITTEE THE LAST ONE. THAT MEANS THEY DIDNT THINK THEY HAD THE VOTES

TO PASS IT. BUT NEITHER DID ANYONE HAVE TO GO ON RECORD

TO SAY WHERE THEY STOOD. >>DAN: ALAN SHINN, WHY DONT YOU WANT THESE

BILLS TO PASS? WHY SHOULDNT WE LEGALIZE IT.

>> I THINK MARIJUANA IS A HEALTH PROBLEM FOR HAWAII AND I THINK LEGALIZATION IS WHAT HAPPENS

WHEN PEOPLE ARE NOT REALLY INFORMED ABOUT THE DRUG.

SO I THINK THE PAST ATTITUDES AND OPINIONS ABOUT MARIJUANA, THERES A LOT OF MISCONCEPTIONS

AND I WOULD SAY THAT ITS A MAJOR PROBLEM IN TERMS OF TRYING TO EDUCATE PEOPLE AND CATCH

THEM UP BECAUSE I THINK MANY OF OUR OPINIONS AND FEELINGS ABOUT MARIJUANA GO WAY BACK TO

I THINK IN THE SIXTIES AND SEVENTIES. WITH ALL THE SCIENCE BASED INFORMATION THAT

WE NOW HAVE ON MARIJUANA, WE HAVENT, OUR OPINIONS AND FEELINGS ABOUT IT HAVE NOT REALLY CAUGHT

UP WITH THE TECHNOLOGY AND THE SCIENCE THAT WE HAVE.

>>DAN: WHAT SCIENCE SPECIFICALLY, I CAN SAY THAT WORD, ARE YOU REFERRING TO THAT SAYS

THAT MARIJUANA IS A HEALTH PROBLEM, THAT ITS GOING TO CAUSE US TROUBLE?

>> WE HAVE TO LOOK AT MARIJUANA LIKE WE LOOK AT OTHER DRUGS.

ITS A PUBLIC HEALTH ISSUE. THERE ARE HARMFUL EFFECTS OF ANY DRUG, BUT

FOR MARIJUANA, WE KNOW THAT ITS LINKED TO ASSOCIATED WITH PSYCHOSIS, DEPRESSION AND

PARANOIA. IM TALKING ABOUT CHRONIC PERSISTENT USE OF

HIGH GRADE POTENT MARIJUANA THAT WE HAVE NOWADAYS. ITS NOT SAME MARIJUANA THAT OUR MAYBE WE SMOKED,

DAN, YOU AND I SMOKED WAY BACK IN THE DAYS. >>DAN: NOT ME.

MAYBE YOU. NOT ME.

>> SO POTENCY IS NOW MUCH HIGHER. MARIJUANA HAS BEEN GMOD AND NOW, WE HAVE POTENCY

LEVELS THAT ARE 10 TIMES WHAT IT WAS IN THE SIXTIES AND 70S.

>>DAN: IS THAT TRUE? I READ SOMETHING ON THAT TOO.

THEY SEEM TO INDICATE IT IS MORE POTENT. >> WELL, THIS IS MISERY.

THE PEOPLE WHO ARE OPPOSED TO MARIJUANA PRETEND THAT ITS DANGEROUS BECAUSE ITS PERHAPS BEEN

IMPROVED FROM 4% TO 8% THC. THATS WHEN THEYRE TALKING ABOUT.

>>DAN: THC IS  >> PSYCHO ACTIVE CHEMICAL IN MARIJUANA.

OR CANNABIS, IF WERE TALKING MEDICALLY, THE PROPER WORD WOULD BE CANNABIS.

MARIJUANA COVERS IT. ANYWAY, THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT, THE DEA ACTUALLY

BRAGS ABOUT HOW EFFECTIVE 100% THC. MARINOL PILLS AND TRIES TO GET US TO BELIEVE

THAT 8% IS DANGEROUS WHILE 100% IS PERFECTLY FINE IN PILL FORM.

SO THERES A DOUBLE STANDARD. IN FACT, THE WHOLE HISTORY OF MARIJUANA REPRESENTS

A DOUBLE STANDARD. IT WAS ORIGINALLY MADE ILLEGAL BECAUSE MUCH

PEOPLE WITH COLOR. MEXICANS AND BLACK MUSICIANS AND BLACK PEOPLE,

IT WAS DEFINITELY MADE TO HURT THESE PEOPLE. IT STILL DOES.

THATS WHOS IN JAIL NOW BECAUSE OF IN ARE HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDS OF PEOPLE OF COLOR, YOUNG PEOPLE

AND IT RUINS THEIR LIFE. HEALTH HAZARDS, I WILL NOT BE ABLE TO NAME.

I ADDRESS THE PSYCHOSIS THING IF YOU LIKE. THATS MANY OF THE THINGS BROUGHT UP THAT ARE

FAULTS. >>DAN: I HAVE READ A LITTLE BIT ON IT.

AS I UNDERSTAND IT, IT CAN BE ADDICTIVE IN ONE ON ONE IN 11 USERS?

>> HAWAII MEDICAL ASSOCIATION HAS RESOLUTION WHICH SAYS THAT IT IS MINIMALLY OR NONADDICTIVE

AND THEY RECOMMEND THAT IT BE DOWN SCHEDULED SO THAT IT CAN BE PROPRESCRIBED.

PERHAPS HE KNOWS MORE THAN THE HAWAII MEDICAL ASSOCIATION ON THERE, BUT I REALLY DOUBT IT.

>> GO HAD HE HAD. >> 2011, THE DEA WAS PETITIONED TO UNSCHEDULE

IT AS A SCHEDULE 1 DRUG. BASED ON SCIENTIFIC EVIDENCE, THEY DECLINED.

SO I WOULD THINK THAT THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT REGULATORS OF MARIJUANA THAT REQUIRE THAT

IT BE SCHEDULE 1 DRUG WOULD KNOW WHAT THEYRE TALKING ABOUT.

>>DAN: DOESNT THE SCIENCE SAY SOMETHING ABOUT IF KIDS USE IT VERY YOUNG, THERES A DANGER?

IN FACT, SOME OF THE DECRIMINALIZATION SAID ITS DECRIMINALIZED FOR PEOPLE OVER 21.

ISNT THAT RIGHT? WHERE COLORADO AND WASHINGTON HAS GONE?

>> RIGHT. ISNT THAT BASED ON SCIENCE?

>> NO. ITS BASED ON GUESS WORK BECAUSE NONE OF US

WANT OUR CHILDREN DOING COFFEE. NONE OF US WANT OUR CHILDREN DOING CIGARETTES.

WE DONT WANT OUR CHILDREN DOING PSYCHO ACTIVE DRUGS EVEN THOUGH WE SOMETIMES LET THEM DRINK

DR. PEPPER AND COCA COLA COULD A FULL OF CAFFEINE.

FEDERAL GOVERNMENT DID NOT BASE THEIR STUDIES ON SCIENCE.

IT WAS PURE POLITICS. JUDGE SAID IT SHOULD BE DOWN SCHEDULED AND

THEY HAVE NO SCIENCE. THIS WAS FEDERAL COURT AND I HAD ENTIRE FEDERAL

BRIEF IN THE DEA. HERES WHAT THEY SAID ABOUT PSYCHOSIS.

IF FROM THE FED DATA. DOES NOT SUGGEST A CAUSATIVE LINK BETWEEN

THE MARIJUANA USE AND DEVELOPMENT OF PSYCHOSIS. IF I GIVE AWE SHOT OF CORE ZONE, HERES THE

THING FROM THE FLIER, CAN LEAD TO FRANK PSYCHOTIC MANIFESTATIONS, EMOTIONAL INSTABILITY OR TSAI

COULD THE PARTICULAR TENDENCIES MAY BE AGGREGATED BY CORTICOSTEROIDS.

KNOWN AS STEROID RAGE. THERES AUTOMOBILE A DOUBLE STANDARDS HERE.

USUALLY HYPOTHETICAL DANGERS OF MARIJUANA BUT THEY NEVER HAVE THE STUDIES OR STUDIES

TO SHOW DANGER. WERE TALKING ABOUT A PILL THATS LESS ADDICTING

THAN CAFFEINE AND SAFER THAN TILE NOT AND ASPIRIN AND YET THEY HAVE IT CLASSIFIED AND

TREATED AS MORE DANGEROUS THAN HEROIN. THERES NO SCIENCE THERE.

PURE POLITICS AND THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT HAS BEEN VERY DISINGENUOUS.

>> DAN, THE CONTROLLED SUBSTANCES ACT MANDATES THAT THE SCHEDULING AND APPROVAL OF DRUGS

INCLUDING MARIJUANA MUST BE DONE ON BOTH LEGAL AND SCIENTIFIC BASIS.

SO IF THEYRE NOT FOLLOWING THE STATUTE AND MAKING POLITICAL DECISIONS, I WOULDNT THINK

THATS WHATS GOING ON. >> STUDIES, THERES BEEN LONG TERM STUDIES

ABOUT THE EFFECTIVE MARIJUANA ON ESPECIALLY YOUNG PEOPLE.

UNDER 18. AND SHOWN THAT THERE IS SCIENCE, THERE ARE

CORRELATES TO MEMORY LOSS, LEARNING DISABILITIES, AND IT GOES ON AND ON.

SO I THINK THAT THERE ARE STUDIES THAT REALLY SHOW THAT, DR. WEBB.

>> IF YOU WANT TO PROTECT THE CHILDREN, YOU HAVE TO BE HONEST.

AND THE PROBLEMS HERE ARE NUMBER ONE, IF YOU LIE TO THE CHILDREN AND TELL THEM MARIJUANA

IS DANGEROUS WHICH I WAS LIED TO AND IT MADE ME VERY SKEPTICAL.

I DIDNT BELIEVE THE OTHER THINGS THEY TOLD ME BECAUSE THEY WERE DISHONEST TO ME AND TOLD

ME MARIJUANA WAS DANGEROUS. THE OTHER THING IS ITS ALREADY AVAILABLE EVERYWHERE.

MY 3 KIDS ALL WENT TO HIGH SCHOOL ON A MILITARY ACADEMY AND THEY COULD GET ANY DRUG THEY WANTED

AT SCHOOL. PROHIBITION MEANS THE DEALER GETS TO DECIDE

WHO DOES IT RATHER THAN THE GOVERNMENT. AND I DONT KNOW.

THATS NOT WHAT I WANT. >> OUR AGENCY DOES PREVENTION.

WILLS DO TREATMENT. WE WORK WITH JUVENILE DRUG COURT.

MANY OF THE KIDS WHO COME IN, YOUTH WHO COME IN HAVE PROBLEMS WITH DRUGS OBVIOUSLY.

AND MARIJUANA IS USUALLY ONE OF THEM. WE SEE A LOT OF PROBLEMS AROUND THEIR CHRONIC

USE OF MARIJUANA. FUNCTIONING LEVELS, JUST THEIR BEHAVIOR, LOWER

FUNCTIONING. THEY HAVE A PROBLEM WITH.

>> JUST LIKE ANY OTHER DRUG. >> IF YOU WANT THE USE TO GO DOWN, IT GOES

DOWN IN COUNTRIES WHERE IT HAS BEEN DECRIMINALIZED. IN HOLLAND, THEY HAVE SINGLE DIGIT TEEN USE.

WE HAVE A WAR ON DRUGS AND WE HAVE 30 SOME% TEEN USE F YOU REALLY WANT TEEN USE AND YOUTH

USE TO GO DOWN, YOU LEGALIZE IT AND REGULATE IT.