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  • today we're getting ball since we're one of the best YouTube channels ever.

  • Okay, since we are like a YouTube channel, two of the hottest, many ball are we not hot eso?

  • Last year we made a video called the Onley Anti aging cream Networks, according to Science, and were immediately shown a video by the incredible lab muffin.

  • That explains some of the things that we got wrong about the complexity of beauty products.

  • So we decided to fly during a global pandemic to Australia, to visit lab muffin because famously you tours can't get or spread Cove it true.

  • I guess we'll just stay home and zoom with her because that's actually really easy.

  • And everyone should be doing that.

  • It's cheaper.

  • Michelle.

  • Okay, Love Muffin.

  • Hi, Michelle.

  • Can you give us a background on who you are?

  • I have a PhD in chemistry, and I've got a background in science education.

  • I've been making videos and blogging about the science behind beauty products since 2011, and I do it so hopefully people who don't have a background in science understand.

  • It's sort of like what you guys do.

  • But for beauty, be honest.

  • When you saw the video.

  • Were you annoyed?

  • I wasn't annoyed.

  • I'm sorry if it felt like I was coming for you, I was actually really excited because it is sort of read that anyone makes ah whole video about skin cat like from a science perspective.

  • So one of the best parts of being YouTubers, I think, is that you get real time feedback on what you're doing.

  • And in the past, we have definitely had to fix, like biological pathways drawings.

  • We've made mistakes or even like the periodic table we've updated.

  • Yes, there was new information that came in for it.

  • And we also once said that it took eight seconds for son to get to Earth, and it's eight minutes, things like that.

  • But with you, this was like a full video.

  • What we thought we could do today is go through our video and you're going to explain the parts that we got wrong.

  • So we're going to sit down with my partner, Mitch, because I don't really know or you skin creams to see if he can actually pick and choose which ones are more effective and teach.

  • You had actually read the ingredients lists of these beauty products to understand from a scientific perspective which ones work.

  • So the very idea of this game is flawed.

  • Some might say Correct.

  • Yeah, there is a bit of a problem with it.

  • In most countries, products have to have an ingredient list, and it's listed in order of decreasing concentration.

  • It's tempting to look at how high an ingredient is on the list to see if you have more of an ingredient.

  • MAWR is usually better, but while you have to have enough of an ingredient for it to work, you can also have too much of an ingredient.

  • And that's when you start to see side effects.

  • Skincare ingredients are often irritating if you have too much soem or is not always better.

  • Another problem with focusing on the ingredients list is that it only really tells you how much of an ingredient you have at the start.

  • Some ingredients, like rational and vitamin C, are unstable, so, for example, 1% regional products from different brands can end up containing very different amounts of rational by the time it gets to you.

  • So if you have a product with a high concentration of an active but It has a pretty crappy delivery system that might not work as well as a product that has a lower concentration but a better delivery system so you can think of formulation like a chocolate cake.

  • Technically, the final chocolate cake and a bag of chocolate cake ingredients would have the same ingredient list.

  • But when you use them in your mouth, it gives you two very different experiences.

  • Is it just something that you just navigate by doing a lot of research before you buy a product?

  • Because if you are just showing up there looking the ingredients lesson reading, what's on the bottle, it's gonna be confused because they're trying to get you to buy it.

  • If you're trying to go for a medicine, you want a medicine that's been proven in clinical trials in skin care because that doesn't actually exist.

  • You kind of have to try to grab anecdotal evidence.

  • So look at reviews.

  • Look at the ingredients list, look at what's on the label and put it all together to try to make a good decision.

  • As somebody who's never really done that much skin care.

  • Honestly, I don't really watch my face.

  • Tough is it to my detriment that I'm not thinking about it that much.

  • Honestly, I think if you're happy with your skin, don't bother your half brown.

  • You'll probably age beautifully.

  • It's me you're not.

  • Don't worry about.

  • Antioxidants are something that are claimed on a lot of products that people are buying.

  • There is not a scientific consensus that antioxidants will help with anti aging.

  • In your video, you talk about how this was misleading, but personally, I had read those studies that you talk about in your video stimulation of college and bio synthesis by topically applied Vitamin C double blind slash half a study comparing topical vitamin C and vehicle for rejuvenation of photo damage.

  • When I read these studies, I didn't comfortably think I could say there was a scientific consensus behind them.

  • The sample sizes were so small it was 10 people in each study.

  • The big problem with skin care is that there just isn't that much funding for it.

  • So we kind of have to take these studies and look at it with a grain of salt.

  • Generally, there are small sample sizes in skincare studies compared to pharmaceuticals, for example, so for skin care.

  • We kind of have to lower our expectations and do a bit of educated guesswork.

  • 10 people with a relatively objective measure, like a biopsy, is generally decent as far a skincare studies go.

  • Vitamin C is regulated as a quasi drug in Japan, which means there's enough evidence that it does something.

  • In this case, it's a pigment fading quasi drug.

  • So the reason it's such small sample sizes is because it's not like a top medical priority toe.

  • Have glowing beautiful skin, a lot of things that claim college and help with wrinkles.

  • But the molecule itself is too large to actually go through your epidermis.

  • What we were talking about earlier, the cretinous sites it does not get through so anything with collagen do not ever buy.

  • Collagen is a very overrated ingredients, but I wouldn't say 100% PS.

  • I'd probably put it back down to maybe 90% p s.

  • Most of the time.

  • It is in there to tell a good story.

  • Like you said, it's too big to get into skin.

  • But even though it's too big, it is really good at acting as a humidity.

  • So Humeston's ingredients that grab onto water and keep it on your skin.

  • Keeping it hydrated can do a lot of good, so it can reduce the appearance of wrinkles.

  • It can help it act as a good barrier against irritants.

  • Collagen does tend to make the product a little bit more expensive.

  • It's really glycerin that's usually during the heavy.

  • Lifting.

  • Their retinal and retinoic acid is what we're gonna talk about right now because it is the Onley face cream for anti aging that there is a scientific consensus about, especially in Western marketing.

  • The idea of wrinkles is really I guess it shouldn't our brains.

  • But in a lot of other countries with different skin types, aging isn't just about wrinkles.

  • So, for example, white skin.

  • You start getting wrinkles late twenties, early thirties with Asian skin.

  • It's a lot later, so I think it's something like forties and fifties.

  • I guess the signs of aging the anti aging products really are targeting things like pigmentation.

  • That's probably the biggest thing for Asians.

  • I've definitely got some hidden under there.

  • Um, yeah, uneven pigment and age spots are much bigger thing because obviously we have a lot more ability to produce pigment So my mom is like half South Asian, like from India.

  • Obviously, I have, like, slightly tanned skin, and I thought about how darker skin protects you from the sun.

  • But I've never really been like.

  • And that is why darker skin doesn't wrinkle or age in that way as early.

  • Yeah, so I guess it's where the same black don't crack comes from so many of the signs studies that I'm reading.

  • They're focusing on wrinkles, and they have moments where they talk about the science of why different skin tones don't age.

  • Our story there, I just said it don't get wrinkles the same way white people do, and then they just move on and go back to talking about wrinkles.

  • It just shows you how like Eurocentric and White science is.

  • There was like a big thing about manifestations of covert in dark skin.

  • There are a lot of dermatologist pointing out that a lot of the pictures off covert manifestations on skin.

  • It was like 90% white skin, and they were like a few pictures of darker skin, and so it was actually a lot harder to diagnose and fix those issues.

  • Question.

  • Should we take our original video down?

  • I don't think so.

  • I think it is really good to have people see how conversations go.

  • Because I think there is a lot of pressure on scientists, especially in 2020 2021.

  • That science is just this perfect monolith.

  • That doesn't change.

  • And I think that's really damaging.

  • Okay, Thank you so much for educating us for coming on.

  • And for your video.

  • Where can people find you?

  • Slash Subscribe to your channels.

  • Chefs kiss Amazing.

  • Thank you s Oh, my channel is lab muffin beauty science.

  • And I am also on instagram.

  • I started on chick talk, but I don't know what I'm doing and on Twitter as well.

  • So it's lab off in beauty science.

  • Old lab muffin, depending on how many letters I'm allowed.

today we're getting ball since we're one of the best YouTube channels ever.

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B1 skin ingredient muffin aging skincare anti aging

Debunking our own video debunking skincare

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    林宜悉 posted on 2021/01/21
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